I have been planning a sticky on menstrual protection, so here it is. “Feminine hygiene” has been episodic through the millennia. Many cultures simply isolated menstruating women and they stayed in special huts where the women took care of themselves with whatever creativity they had. Some women over the centuries used animal skins, worn out clothing or simply shields that allowed drainage. During the nineteenth century, old bed sheets torn into long strips and then folded became the standard. You can still these on drying lines in some parts of rural Europe. Commercial products appeared in the early twentieth century with Kotex being the first commercially successful brand. Tampons appeared in the 1930s and the various cups after that. The first cup was invented by a Danish ballerina and became somewhat known among female athletes. A wonderful history of menstrual products is at www.mum.org

Most of us started with napkins. Mainly because our mother’s demanded that and we could not figure out how to use tampons without help – which we did not want to ask for. To this day, these two products absolutely dominate the market. The products that are less known, less used and less sold are the “menstrual cups.” There is one disposable on the market and there are three brands of reusable cups. All three have websites with descriptions and instructions and they are for sale through these sites – Keeper, Moon Cup and Diva. The Keeper is latex and should be avoided by women with latex allergy but the same company makes the Moon Cup. I used a Keeper for over seven years until it developed small cracks in the rim. I have used a Diva since. The Diva and the Moon Cup are silicone and I have no idea how long they will last.

When you first look at these, you wonder, “How?” Really, quite simple – a few times in and out and you will be comfortable. They come in two sizes – one for women with no children and one for women who have borne children. One of them also recommends that women “over 30” use the larger size. I am well over thirty but have had no children. I am still wearing the “small” size and probably will until menopause. I have never had an accident with either the Keeper or the Diva and often wear it up to ten hours at a stretch without “draining” it. It is recommended that every several hours it be removed, rinsed and re-inserted. I often wear it all day for work; remove it for a few hours getting ready for bed and reinsert for the night. I have gone more than the recommended limit of twelve hours and always wear it overnight.

The instructions for use are quite clear – on the website and with the product. They are inconvenient to use in public facilities. The removal, rinsing and reinserting requires a degree of privacy. I prefer to remove mine standing in the shower but have accomplished what needs to be done behind a tree on a bike trail. Although I keep tampons in the car and my desk drawer for surprises, I use the Diva exclusively. These are quite expensive up front but when you consider how many tampons I would have used in the seven years with the Keeper, they are cheaper in the long term. I have read medical articles questioning the possibility of nerve damage behind the anterior vaginal wall as a result of the constant (not noticeable) pressure. I am aware of no documented cases of damage and have never noticed this in myself.

There is one disposable cup on the market – Instead. It looks like a flexible (but deep) cervical cap and comes in one size. I have tried these but have had poor results. If the size fits you, great; otherwise, accidents do happen. I was never able to sleep through the night without marking my territory. My girlfriend has had satisfactory results with Instead but uses a Diva regularly. Instead is marketed as the only menstrual protection that can be left in place during sex. Eva and I have found this works and makes menstrual sex less messy. With neither of us having a penis, a tampon works, too. We have each tried with men and found that it works quite well but there are still some tracks. Instead has the same difficulties of use in a public facility as do the other cups. Although it does not have to be rinsed and re-inserted, you do have to “dig deeper” to remove it than the reusable cups and then have red fingers to put your clothing back in place. I find the Diva to be less messy when changing. Instead is flexible and I have never been able to remove one without spilling; the Diva and Keeper are more rigid and less likely to spill.

As an aside, I have one patient who fills an Instead with vaginal jelly and uses it as contraceptive cervical cap! Not sold as such but women can be inventive.

A monthly supply of Instead is a lot cheaper than buying a Moon or Diva. But the savings over the years are considerable. The cups are not for everyone but I cannot imagine returning to tampons on a regular basis. I have driven the length of England without changing; ridden 100 miles on a bicycle; sailed through lengthy storms on the North Sea and, even, forgotten about it and left it in place for thirty-six hours (not recommended!). Check them out at their websites.

After using Insteads, I can hardly stand to go back to pads and tampons!! Tampons would hurt me if I used two in a row, and it's like my body just.. hated them. My vagina would clench up and I couldn't get it all the way in, so it ended up being REALLY uncomfortable. Come to figure out later, they were causing me cramps!!

And we all know what pads feel like... especially if you have a heavy flow like I do. Yuck!

With Insteads, they say it's safe to leave them in for up to 12 hours (on a lighter day) but no matter how heavy, it lasts twice as long as pads or tampons (which is true). However, sometimes when you take it out and it's full, some blood will gush out, but if the toilet is right next to the sink you can just have the water running and rinse it right off.

The only other problem is that they are a lot more expensive. But I don't really consider this a problem because if they last twice as long, you only use half as much =]

All in all.. they are wonderful!! www.instead.com

In all honesty Brandye, these cups differ from the cervical cap (Spermicidal jelly) how? The cervical cap I had was a rubber type product (red; though some are yellowish), not representative of the one on planned parents site. It could be left in for a few days (I did not have the one with the one way valve) but I believe the recommendation was to take it out every 24 hours, wash, reinsert.

I used the cervical cap for a menstrual cap!

Sera,

The menstrual cups that are reuseable and last a long time are more rigid and sturdier and deeper. They fit a bit lower in the vagina and are designed to have a more leak-proof fit.

It is possible to have sex with a disposable menstrual cup (in fact, their marketing literature points this out) because they are so similar to a cervical cap - only a bit deeper but at least as flexible. The reuseable cannot be left in with penetration.

I have know others who used the cervical cap that way. I guess you get double use. But, they are more likely to leak because they do not have the seal against the vaginal walls.

I am really interested in trying Diva cups, I was just looking at their website. I had heard about Insteads but I heard that they leaked sometimes, so I wasn't really desperate to switch. I've never had a problem with tampons and I have pretty light periods. But I just saw this thread and after looking at the Diva Cup website, it sounds pretty cool. I especially like the environmental angle - I always thought tampons and pads were so wasteful, so it's good to know there's an alternative. I guess I want to get one but at the same time it sounds too good to be true. The website listed a couple of local stores where I can find them, so I might be converting soon.

Thanks for the info Brandye!

You are welcome.

I have tried Instead simply because I think I should have experience with most of what I recommend. I had leaks every night that I used them and needed a pad as backup. Eva has had better luck. We both use Divas now.

The average woman will use over 6,000 tampons during her lifetime. That is a lot of stuff to be disposed. Instead is polyurethan and will last a very long time laying in a ladfill. Part of my liking reuseable cups is that but the other is that in many years I have never had a failure (read embarassment or mess).

Instead are quite pliable and in a fixed diameter. If you are that size, it should do a great job. If you are a different size, it will likely leak.

I bought my diva cup three days ago on the first day of my period...my really good college friend swears by it! So far so good. Although I have been extremely heavy these first few days and I have had to empty the cup several times during the day, I love it. I even had some "fun" with a guy the other night and he was impressed by my new device. I am telling every girl I know about it. Totally worth it.

I tried the Instead cup just recently. I had a bit of difficulty with insertion and placement at first, but was ok after that.

I will agree that I couldn't remove it without spilling it. I actually prefer pads and tampons, for the most part. If I plan to have any sexual activity though, I will use the Instead cup.

Do not ignore the reuseable cups. My partner and I both use Diva and I had used the Keeper for seven years.

The diva cup is amazing.....although I will admit that when I get aroused and I have it in I notice a little leakage....but that might be because I am still new to using it.

Asking on behalf of gf who doesn't have internet atm-

She recently tried Instead Cups and apparently is too short when not aroused. The back end of the rim wouldn't go in more than .5in from the entrance.

In the diagrams, the Diva Cup appears to stay more in the canal than the fornix. Her vaginal muscles are in pretty good shape and are fairly tight, however she does fit me which is about 7in circumference at times. She would like to know how rigid the silicone Diva Cup would feel in comparison to the Instead rim and also if anyone has had a similar problem with Instead and fixed it with the Diva or Moon.

Her cycles are very heavy, lasting up to a week, and the tampons make her very raw and sore during and a few days after it's done. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks a bunch.

[quote=funinthesun;213407]Asking on behalf of gf who doesn't have internet atm-

She recently tried Instead Cups and apparently is too short when not aroused. The back end of the rim wouldn't go in more than .5in from the entrance.

In the diagrams, the Diva Cup appears to stay more in the canal than the fornix. Her vaginal muscles are in pretty good shape and are fairly tight, however she does fit me which is about 7in circumference at times. She would like to know how rigid the silicone Diva Cup would feel in comparison to the Instead rim and also if anyone has had a similar problem with Instead and fixed it with the Diva or Moon.

Her cycles are very heavy, lasting up to a week, and the tampons make her very raw and sore during and a few days after it's done. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks a bunch.[/quote] Brandye has more info about the types, they are not over abundant here in the US.

It sounds as if the positioning of them is more of an issue for her; she is not getting it to grip in the right positions or she might have ordered the incorrect size. If properly positioned, there should be no issue.

Or she can get the old type of cervical caps which have been used for birth control and menstrual cycles; they still make them. When they are placed properly no moving/dislodging them. Just have to be cleaned more frequently daily.

With the Instead, she is not inserting it correctly. We are all deep enough to get them in. The rim should encircle the cervix so it requires some learning to get it in and positioned that deeply. Instead are not sold by size and I suspect that is the reason they work better for some than others. As sera indicates, it is very much like the cervical cap contraceptive device. I even know of women who use them as such but that is not what they are sold for. When I have tried them, it took a few times to get it right. I do not use them as a rule because I prefer the reuseable cups. I presently have a Diva.

The reuseable cups - Keeper, Diva, Luna - are placed in the canal above the muscles that we squeeze in doing Kegels. They are folded as per the diagram on the websites and placed about as far as she can reach. They come in two sizes. One for non-parous women (no vaginal births) under thirty and one that is slightly larger recommended for "older women" and those who have had children. They are daunting until she gets accustomed and they cannot be felt when in proper position. The extracting ring will be just out of sight. The silicon of the Diva is quite soft. I assume the Luna is about the same. The latex Keeper, which I used for seven years, was a bit firmer but manageable. They are firmer than the rim of the Instead but, for me, more dependable.

Believe me, any woman can use these cups. It does take practice. When I received my first one (a Keeper), I practiced mid-month and then wore a pad for my first period to make sure I had gotten it right. When my Diva arrived, I just started using it the same as the Keeper.

I have the same issue with tampons leaving me a bit raw and sore. My periods are very heavy but quite short. I have never had a failure and have worn the Diva twelve hours and more.

Just to be certain we're on the same page-- it's bent like the diagram, and it goes in, but only so far to the point where the rim stays bent and the back end of it is only 0.5in inside. You're saying that it should be able to go in further, but is catching on something that is not the back of her? Would it help to add some lube to it to see if it slides more to her shape? She said that she could feel it hit her cervix, but could that be the front of it and it needs to drop down to go around it? She fiddled for it for about 30min this morning and couldn't get it to go in further.

[quote=funinthesun;213434]Just to be certain we're on the same page-- it's bent like the diagram, and it goes in, but only so far to the point where the rim stays bent and the back end of it is only 0.5in inside. You're saying that it should be able to go in further, but is catching on something that is not the back of her? Would it help to add some lube to it to see if it slides more to her shape? She said that she could feel it hit her cervix, but could that be the front of it and it needs to drop down to go around it? She fiddled for it for about 30min this morning and couldn't get it to go in further.[/quote]Tell her squat to try to put it in until accustomed! Lube? Might get a flying object! It should adhere without difficulty if she positions herself correctly. When first using a C. Cap? Took a long time to get used to self-placement! Then it was really easy.

The rim of either the single-use or reuseable cups do not contain a spring as does a diaphragm. The Instead is quite flexible and is solid polyurethan. Not very strong or rigid. The Instead fits over the cervix and holds itself in place by natural adhesion.

The reuseable cups are either latex (Keeper) or silicone (Luna, Diva) and are less flexible than the Instead. They are still quite easy to fold twice. They are held in place in the vaginal canal by muscles and are sealed against the walls with annular seals around the outside rim.. Look at their websites for a view of them in place.

With the problem she is having, it needs to be pushed in much further and the rim then distributed around the cervix. This takes some digging. Lube will make the problem worse. She is not clearing the muscles around the vaginal introitus.

OK, I watch too much sports....for a moment I thought the mention of a Menstrual Cup was a new women's hockey league. ;)

[quote=Thresher_V;213513]OK, I watch too much sports....for a moment I thought the mention of a Menstrual Cup was a new women's hockey league. ;)[/quote]It's a new league, one which has been undisclosed for years! The winner of the cup series is....;)

I am currently taking part in a research study about the Mooncup at medical school!

ok can someone give me help with these then as i have to use pads at the moment which i hate and have to wear black trousers etc when im on my period, trouble is tho i have no idea how you use these things, do you put them in like a tampon and have some sort of applicator? and how do you get them back out again after, do you have to go fishing, as if thats the case then its a no no for me and im stuck with using pads then as i cant even get a tampon out myself should i have a string com eaway, this has happened to me before and had to get hubby to fish it out. so having to stick my fingers inside me to get it out would be a big problem

I have been using the diva cup for a few months now and I LOVE IT! It was a little challenging to put in at first but it's pretty simple. I can't feel it at all and it doesn't leak at all, even when I'm aroused. It's so nice to just have this tiny cup to carry around instead of a handful of pads or tampons. I'm never going back!

Orgless,

There are three major manufacturers - Diva, Moon Cup and the Keeper. Each has a website which shows insertion and removal. These are all reusable while Instead is a throwaway. The Keeper is latex and the other two are silicone. I used a Keeper for seven years and a Diva for even longer.

They each have a ring on the top (bottom?) that is easily reachable just inside you. Sometimes it is necessary to run a finger up the side to break the suction.

Don't know if anyone's still reading this... Is the [url=http://www.softcup.nl/]Softcup one of the disposible kinds?

Tried these, but I think that it really isn't comfortable at all. 'Risk of urinary tract infection' is what is says in the instruction. Well, although I didn't let it come that far, I'm sure it will! ;) It's very messy taking it out. And when you bump into it, it rustles (great having sex with background music ;-))

Maybe I will experiment more some day :) For now: I really love [url=http://www.beppy.com//index?l=4]Beppy Wet tampons. Don't feel a thing while wearing. Takes way more fluid than a maxi-tampon. Easy to put in and get out: Very gentle and soft material, not the stiff kind that 'unfolds' while putting it in. You just need to be able to reach far back to get the little loop, (although it also works perfectly when it's not so close to your cervix. It shapes to your body!). Could be used during intercourse, but my bf and I simply do not like it (cause the area around my cervix is way to pleasant :rolleyes:) Does come in handy with foreplay: no strings attached ;-). A pity that it is expensive :( Worth my money having a happy period, though!

Sorry that was missed. That is exactly what is named Instead in the English speaking world. I, too, had disappointing results but no a few women who use them regularly. One of the wonders of the menstrual cup is that it is reusable - that is Luna, Diva, Keeper. Considering that we each use about 7000 tampons, this is a real advantage.

Thanx for the reply :) What about the risk of urinary tract infection? Does that also aply to menstrual cups such as Luna, Diva, Keeper? And how 'risky' is that anyway?

Urinary tract infection is not vaginal but urethral. The risk is the same as anything that has you probing around yourself. The cup should be washed and given a vinegar soak - one part white vinegar, 2 parts warm water - after each period for twenty minutes or so. This is true for anything you insert vaginally - diaphragm, toys, cervical cap.

I used a Keeper for seven years until it developed cracks in the rim. Keeper is made of latex. Then I used a (silicone) Diva for about ten years. I had no infection of any sort that could be attributed to the cup.

There are a few physicians who claim that the pressure from the rim of the cup rides on a nerve along the anterior side of the vagina (under the tissue, not part of the vagina) that could be damaged. I am not personally aware of anyone affected by this. The reusable cups cannot be left in place for sex as the disposables can. That would be a challenge for a penis!

Although not recommended, I have worn a cup for well over twelve hours at a stretch. I always liked to do the removal in the shower where the mess was contained and the cup could be rinsed easily. It also does all right on a bidet or, even, a toilet. They are not convenient in public wc, hence my extended wear on occasion.

I have owned Diva Cups for years and will never again go back to tampons or pads. Aside from the comfort factor, and the cost, there is also the lack of waste, reduced risk of TSS, and longer wear times. I love it.

I've had a DivaCup for over three years now. I would have bought it sooner, but I wasn't able to order online and nobody used to sell them here. Then I noticed this one environmentally friendly shop selling them for 50 bucks. I saved up and got one. Now I see grocery stores with them for 30.

Prior to my Diva, I used primarily old flannels that were too worn for face-washing anymore. I started doing that because I was too poor to afford store-bought products. But I continued using them because tampons didn't work for me, because my flow is too light and tends to stop especially overnight. Plastic pads are brutal. You get a rash, and plastic does not absorb in the least. They're so wasteful and expensive, as well as uncomfortable and generally gross to use. To this day, I still use converted flannels once in a while. It's comfy and they absorb great.

I'm planning on scouting around for Insteads. I don't like that it's disposable, and hear people saying they're messy to take out and harder to get in, but being that you can wear them during sex I might like to keep some on handy for special occassions.

It's still really hard for me to understand why so many women still use tampons and plastic pads. And I can't believe how many women are still not aware of the other options out there! I guess it's just what they're told to do, and they never bother to question. A shame really. I love my Cup!

If you are happy with the Diva, do not mess around with Instead. I tried them mainly because if I am making recommendations, I should at least try them out. Because they go right over the cervix, they have to be a good fit. I believe they are 65 mm. There is still the waste of disposables; they are harder to place and remove than the reuseable cups; they can be a real mess to deal with in public loos and. for me, there was a leakage problem at night.

My girlfriend also tried them and had better success. They are sold with the statement that they can be left in place during sex. But, those of us who really like menstrual sex have learned to deal with that in many ways every way from burgundy towels to screwing in the bathtub. I used a Keeper for seven years until it started to develop cracks in the rim (they are latex) and then a Diva (silicone) for nearly ten years. How many disposeables would that cover?

My thinking is really the same. I definately agree about disposables. I just thought that softcups would be beneficial for the odd occassion. Not all men are so easy-going about having menstrual sex. I've never had a problem with mess. In fact, many nights that I'm still menstrual I sleep nude without my cup in. I just put dark sheets on in case, but every morning I wake up and there's nothing at all. The few times I've had period sex where there's actually been blood, it was just a pink smudge on the tip of his dick, or a little smear on my thigh or something. I don't really need a towel. I have sex with my boyfriend on my period without even telling him, because oddly enough I don't bleed at all. Like, we'll sleep together, no blood, I'll go to bed naked and no cup, no blood, I'll get up in the morning and then go shopping til two in the afternoon, no blood, and then I'll stop at a gas station to go pee and there's blood in the toilet so I put my cup back in. But as un-problematic as it is from that angle, I don't want to surprise someone I'm not that close with, and if I tell someone, "I'm on my period" they're not likely to want to sleep with me even if I make the suggestion of the shower. So I thought Instead would be good for the odd time a guy asks me out and I'm still menstrual so I don't have to deal with awkward conversations and rude rejections.

I never felt rejected. It was a simple matter of if he chose not to, I chose to not give another chance. Women are women and one of the things we do is menstruate. If a man is bothered by that he could always find some woman who was embarassed about it. We spend fifteen percent of our fecund lives bleeding. Learn to deal with it, men!

About fifteen percent hey? That's brutal. I'd like to be more assertive about it, but I live in a small town and I'm worried if I start rejecting more guys for something like that I won't be left with anything at all. I've only come across one guy who was willing to do it, my live-in boyfriend, and he no longer will (which is why I just don't tell him). It's really disappointing when a handsome guy wants to hook up for the night, and then there's that, and he isn't even willing to take a raincheck. I feel like cracking em over the head! How do you find guys that aren't so squeamish and finicky? Especially when you're not in a big city? Like I say, I'm pretty light, but all these guys seem to have this idea in their head it's gonna look like a massacre or something. I thought at first maybe they just had a bad experience? But that can't be true of them all, so where are they getting these ideas anyway?

So I just started thinking that if he wants to play at hubby, then he has to deal with it. But if it's more casual, I guess I can allow them to be finicky, so I thought maybe a softcup would be good for those situations. Really I think I'm doing a lot better than most women. All the girls I know give their boyfriends blowjobs when they're bleeding. I won't do that. And if anyone refuses me, then asks for a blow, I suggest you duck. It's my crotch that's bleeding- You should be doing me favours, not the other way around if anything! *deep breath* But I would like to know where to meet more guys that are willing to just get real. I would. I just don't know where they are, and I'm not even sure if they exist either. If I found them, I'd tell the other ones what they can do with themselves.

[QUOTE=FadedLove;259544]I just don't know where they are, and I'm not even sure if they exist either.[/QUOTE]
Dear FadedLove, I can assure you they exist; I know one. And as long as one swan is black, it is falsified that they are all white :) But I never really looked for it, just bumped into one, so I can't really help you with your search :(

There are quite a few women who do not want it, like this thread shows (http://www.sexinfo101.com/forum/member-polls/25655-time-month-ladies-onl...). Don't know if there's a thread on how men think about it... anyone else found it? If not, you could start a poll :)

Thanx for giving me that link. I didn't realise that so many women were so freaked out by themselves! I thought it was just the guys who were being wierd. I guess I was wrong. I just can't fathom why a woman would feel that way! When I was browsing over that sex survey posting, it seemed like most men said, "No" about that. But no explanations as to why..

I used a cup for seventeen years - first a Keeper (latex) and then a Diva (silicone). Latex does degenerate over time and I would recommend a silicone cup. Yes, they are round but should adapt to your shape. You may wish to ask your gyn about this because with a non-standard shape, the larger diameter will be indicated. Without taking a look, I cannot make a recommendation. You may to adjust the position but should be able to make it work. I had very heavy, but thankfully short, periods and had no difficulty with leakage although in trying the disposable cups I did have leakage problems. Each of us is a bit different.

A great feature of the cup is that you can wear it for extended periods eliminating the need for cleaning in public facilities. It is recommended for eight hours with twelve hour limit sometimes mentioned as a preventative for toxic shock. I have worn one longer cycling, during travel and when kept at a work project that cannot be interrupted. It does get a bit disgusting but never resulted in leakage. When faced with the situation you describe, I took a few paper towels into the WC put those in my knickers for the brief time to rinse it. Then popped it back in. Or with a bottle, put the paper towels in position, stand up and rinse over the toilet and then dispose of the towels in the bin.

When at home, I would usually sit on the bidet, remove it, wash it and me and put it back in.

Boop

I er... I've been thinking about the Mooncup for environmental reasons. I know a girl who has one and she seems pretty happy with it, but there are two practical questions I feel a bit weird asking her.

1. The shape of the cup is circular, yes? Personally I have problems with tampons leaking down one side because the lower part of my vagina is sort of a D shape (tight front to back, but spacious side to side) and tampons have a tendency to move to one side. I'm concerned that a cup wouldn't maintain a seal and I'd end up with leakage at one of the "corners" just like with tampons.

I suppose I could just wear a pad too on the heavy days but that would defy the point of the environmental reason for considering a cup in the first place.

2. I've heard it said in answer to "how do I clean it in a public toilet" to take a bottle of water with you to rinse it out. But I don't understand how this works. You're sitting down - or at least I'd have to be sitting down because my period won't stop and wait for me to be clean the cup. Standing up while not wearing protection is out of the question. So where do you rinse into? Try and do it through the space in my legs...?

This won't just be a problem in public because a lot of people I know don't have sinks in their toilet; you have to leave the toilet room and go to the batrhoom to wash your hands. I could rinse it in the sink, and use what for protection in the meantime? My periods are constant on the heavy days so any time I remove my protection I have to think about where I'm going to bleed into. Does one sit over the bath?

People keep telling me the mooncup is not messy, and I can't help but think that's not going to be the case for me.

That actually makes a bidet seem like a more useful appliance than I'd previously considered...! Sadly they aren't standard in this neck fo the woods.

Yeah I've got an appointment for that IUD coming up so I'll ask her about it. I shall have to start making a list of things I need to ask her! I've also sent off some enquiries to the mooncup people about their reccomendations :)

I really do like the idea, I'm just a bit nervous about investing £20 before I know if it'll work well.

Thankyou Brandye you're always a help and I appreciate it

I would not chose to live without a bidet. It is an amazingly useful appliance and the best device there is to keep everything nice and clean.