Circumcisions & cervical cancer - whats the greater good?

[sera300]

Hugh:

Well, all one has to do is go to Blackwell & see your name which is also linked to your circumcision site. Pretty easy when you purchase the full abstract from Blackwell, read the info., and then read your site...pretty easy to find you & then Google your name with circumcision. All the same names--coincidence; I doubt it.

Here are a few added readings for you from the WHO & UNAIDS:
http://www.unaids.org/en/KnowledgeCe...rcumcision.asp

CDC:
http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/resources/fac...rcumcision.htm

NHS:

http://www.worcestershirehealth.nhs....malecircum.pdf
Note the NHS states it's parental choice in addition to the other reasons indicated.

[sera300]

Here are the links:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.a...h%2F2001-11%3F&

http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi...1998.tb10078.x

http://www.circumstitions.com/References.html

Now it did not take long to find & search your "wording" through all the posts, the sources here [above], to search deeper from the Anthropology site. Found the same info from an Anthropologist [with the Hugh Young] in New Zealand, with your same name, with same rhetoric, wording, and stats. I also wonder about your credentials [Anthropology] since you are not published, and document yourself on sites as an "independent researcher". Yet in other forums you state you are credentialed as an Anthropologist? Additionally, I note a large Egyptian connection to circumcision despite the above links of it being done in early Egyptian times.

http://www.adl.org/PresRele/CvlRt_32/5214_32.htm

From your private site attorney is as follows:
John V. Geisheker, J.D., LL.M.
Executive Director,
General Counsel,
Doctors Opposing Circumcision
DoctorsOpposingCircumcision.org
2132 Westlake Ave. N., Suite #150
Seattle, WA 98109
tel +1. 206. 465. 6636

Note the same attorney for Misha in the end of the excerpt:
http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...fo/appeal.html

Many "coincidences". Such as quoted from Hugh's post on another site "I'm posting to alt.circumcision. This thread began with a forged post
to alt.circumcision alone. Steve Hayes kept the header and crossposted
his new message to the African and anthropological ngs but didn't
specify Africa in his question."

"Description: Discussion of issues related to the NZ queer community."

YOU have me rolling on the floor laughing since YOU do not practice medicine...aka "boy wonder"


Cyclefreak, I respect your opinion, understand you care what happens within your Country, as you would imagine I feel the same--informed consent is what is practiced in the US. Sydney is very nice as is a few of surrounding areas--long flight though!

[curious Al]

Originally Posted by sera300

So curious AL: What is your conclusion? Planning on skipping the procedure now in your son? Enough opinion's posted for you to make such a choice.

Information overload lol! I really appreciate everyone’s posts. Despite the medical terminology/information battle, all points made were very interesting.

I didn’t initially have a strong opinion for cir or not. From all the arguments made, and to be honest, I know my penis best, I feel that it wouldn’t be in my interest to have the op.

Although both sides make very interesting points, I feel unconvinced by the arguments for the procedure, with the thought "if it’s not broke, don’t fix it" bouncing around. I don’t have any issues with my foreskin so I think it wouldn’t be wise to have the op.

It seems no one will truly know the real advantages/disadvantages of the procedure, without performing a survey on whole countries. And then it would really only be relevant to people within that region.

[sera300]

Originally Posted by curious Al

Information overload lol! I really appreciate everyone’s posts. Despite the medical terminology/information battle, all points made were very interesting.

I didn’t initially have a strong opinion for cir or not. From all the arguments made, and to be honest, I know my penis best, I feel that it wouldn’t be in my interest to have the op.

Although both sides make very interesting points, I feel unconvinced by the arguments for the procedure, with the thought "if it’s not broke, don’t fix it" bouncing around. I don’t have any issues with my foreskin so I think it wouldn’t be wise to have the op.

It seems no one will truly know the real advantages/disadvantages of the procedure, without performing a survey on whole countries. And then it would really only be relevant to people within that region.

I would say if no difficulties with working fine--leave it alone! There are medical opinions; however, if you have no issue leave it be, why undergo unnecessary surgery? If matters arise later in life, deal with them at that time. Just remember "wrap the rascal"--condoms are a must.

[Ducy]

Curious...I think you should definitely do whatever you think is best. Cuz we have way to many different opinions and there are a lot of things that are unsuitable for a proper debate.

Search for some unbaised boards that talk both about the pro's and con's of having foreskin because everyone has their own views on the subject

[Hugh7]

I have no idea where sera gets the idea that I have ever claimed to be an anthropologist. (She doesn't seem to understand about crossposting in newsgroups - which are all open to the public anyway.)

I have no idea who the Hugh Young who wrote to BJOG: An International Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology about pregnant women with syphilis is. There's a Hugh Young in Singapore who gets in the news a lot for financial advice. Am I him too? (At least sera didn't have to be told - but thought it worth mentioning - that I'm not a professor of urology who died in 1945!)

I have no idea what all her links are supposed to be getting at. John Geishecker is an attorney in Seattle who is kept at work full-time just on botched circumcision cases. Doesn't that tell you something? He is also acting for the mother in the case of a man who wants to circumcise his son, now 13, to spite her. (That certainly does raise the question, if as sera claims, parents are free to cut parts off their children, when does that freedom end? 13? 18? 25? And why then and not a day, a week, a month, years earlier?)

If someone posts a question about circumcision in a public forum, like this one, anyone is allowed to answer. Nobody has to be a doctor. Nobody is pretending to be a doctor.

When sera studied medicine, they failed to teach her about science. Science is not about the last word being handed down from on high by some Authority, it is about the free exchange of ideas. It is the ideas that matter, not the people who express them, nor the letters after their names. There is much about the foreskin and circumcision we don't yet know. These will be found out by science, and by the free exchange of ideas, not by dogmas delivered in mocking tones.

At the same time, science (like medicine) is a human endeavour, subject to human biases and frailties, and if you are a circumcised man in a circumcising society, there is a danger that your study of circumcision will be distorted by those two facts. That is one reason I read studies out of the US supporting circumcision with a skeptical eye.

(Sera's NHS link uses the wonderful expresssion "redundant foreskin". This "diagnosis" has no definition in medicine and no symptoms, it just means "more foreskin than someone - usually a circumcised doctor - is comfortable with".)

[sera300]

It's just ironic read your site and it links a person to all these; meanwhile, each have the same "rhetoric". Ironic Hugh...LOL!

[Hugh7]

Originally Posted by sera300

It's just ironic read your site and it links a person to all these; meanwhile, each have the same "rhetoric". Ironic Hugh...LOL!

I still don't know what sera thinks she is getting at. Rhetoric? What rhetoric?

Her fascination with the value of medical qualifications has reminded me of the old couplet with the punchline:

Doctors should attend the sick and leave the well alone.

Another highly regarded doctor, Hippocrates, said:

First, do no harm.

[Ducy]

OMFG!

Lets just drop this cuz it is ridicullous. The OP already made up his mind. GET OVER IT!

[sera300]

Originally Posted by Ducy

OMFG!

Lets just drop this cuz it is ridicullous. The OP already made up his mind. GET OVER IT!

With you on that one Ducy! LOL!