the world is coming to what people make of it.
Start voting and acting differently

You have me pretty confused, Alban. Start voting? This is not a topic which is "up" for reform in an upcoming election. And unless Newtolove is a US citizen, there is no vote for him. The purpose of the parents intent was to draw attention to the school policy through gaining media coverage.

Act differently? Many do, this is a small isolated incident & it's up to the parent's of this particular school district to enact change through demanding reform. Many schools have instituted very harsh policies due the the violence present at middle school and high schools. Look at gang violence--look for the salient issue.

When you vote differently, anywhere in the world, people start getting new ideas and may take other people to vhange theirs. That's how you change the world.

On this case it's no different. If I was the parent I might take my kid away form the school, write a news report, anything. Just get people to think about things with half a brain. I'm growing tired of people feeling sorry for something and not acting on matters.

In a Democracy there is no voting "different" since the concepts are held by the nation not by the individual, there are three parties all with different with separate agendas. We vote in our own way, within each nation, not globally. What is good for the US may not be good for another country and visa verse.

Opting to put your kids in private schools are a parent's prerogatives. The reason for the mandate? Who knows. Generally when strict policy is enforced there have been cases behind it such as; gangs, sexual harassment, weapons, etc. Once the policy is set, it cannot be applied differently since past practice supercedes current policy. If there is an exception made for one the same has to be made for others'. A high five may be no real issue but allowing the contact how do you then prevent the gangs from carrying through with their inter-personal contact? I do not agree with the case it's self but many times there were other issues which led to this type of strict policy.

The attempt of the parents here is not to complain but to demonstrate how a specific policy applied can affect one type of individual; thus, the result of the report is to effectuate change.

Many do think differently and creating change in the US is a slow matter. Understanding the workings of the government and why it exists; is a good place for many to begin, layering effects are created through grassroots organizations and through interest groups.

USA's idea of democracy is wrong. And I'm not talking about Bush, but the system itself. Votes don't matter in a whole, and that's why you have the anecdotical "popular vote". In my country there isn't ANY other! The way the system is made, you can have less votes and be elected President. Yay for Democracy...

anyway

[quote]In a Democracy there is no voting "different" since the concepts are held by the nation not by the individual[/quote]

that's the problem. The parties held limited concepts on which you have no saying. A Global Dictatorship is being organized in Europe as we speak. Try to find out why.

[quote]What is good for the US may not be good for another country and visa verse[/quote]

Tell your rulers that, will you? thanks :)

[quote]Generally when strict policy is enforced there have been cases behind it such as; gangs, sexual harassment, weapons, etc.[/quote]

Nope. It's because you can control the students better, that's all. And freedom of speech and action is then robbed. THAT causes frustration and violence.

[quote]The attempt of the parents here is not to complain but to demonstrate how a specific policy applied can affect one type of individual; thus, the result of the report is to effectuate change.[/quote]

Which never happens because the institution, which is holding all the cards, will only get hit if they run out of customers. They don't read reports and they don't care about people complaining, otherwise they would have changed policies already.

[quote]Many do think differently and creating change in the US is a slow matter. Understanding the workings of the government and why it exists; is a good place for many to begin, layering effects are created through grassroots organizations and through interest groups.[/quote]

Which means instead of trying to change the system, which would be the answer, one has to try and "be a good boy" and enter the system, and then try to beg for some change inside the system. Fine. Not good for me, though :D Thank anyway ;)

Obviously you hate the US. Your personal preference. When one understands how the government works both in politics and administration there is a better option to change.

I doubt the US government is going to change the political system to suit you, me, or anyone else for that matter. It's the system which our country is founded upon.

When you have studied the issues presently before the education boards, it's not about "being a good boy". It's how to suit an entire population as a whole. Understanding the current issues of school violence, sexual harassment, etc has a trade off with expelling students which are problematic; thus, increasing the uneducated portion of the population widening class systems gaps. There is freedom of speech & freedom of actions but life does hold boundry's for all; there are rules in life and kids need to learn them the same as adults. One can not do as they wish all the time. I find it ironic how you can comment on such issues when you are not currently involved in them here in the US.

In the educational system many parents chose to remove their kids and place them in private schools, charter schools, or to home school. That IS a choice & the basis of the educators choices are performed on National standards and reports.

As far as the US rulers, this does not mean we all voted for him (them), and noticeably there is only a 28% approval rating. Many disagree with the current administration and the current tactics world-wide; however, when one has stood in the aftermath/shambles of 9-11, a definitive action was necessary. Many in the US do not approve of the administrations current scope.

It's ironic, I do try to understand other's ways of life and have an appreciation for it, weather I agree with it or not. I do try not to insult those unlike myself regardless of their religion or their political beliefs.

I am merely attempting to explain a system which I have formally studied for years to someone who has no appreciation nor willingness to wish to learn about it.

I agree that it's extreme to not allow hand shakes or High 5s, but this kid knew about the "no touching" rule and yet he still put his arm around his g/f.

Even if it has nothing to do w/ violence...maybe it'll be an end to things like
5th graders having sex in classroom

Or there was another thread where a girl who's 12 said she'd given HJs in class before.
Rules aren't strict until people start taking advantage of the mild/moderate rules they have in place.
Like at my work... some people have been taking advantage and leaving early/ coming in late...long lunches..etc.... so now they are wanting to enforce stricter rules about time/attendance. Now if those people had performed w/in the limits set...then it wouldn't have been a problem...it's when you try to go outside the limits...that they become more strict.

And yes we all have freedoms of speech and expression...but then when we are in school...at work...etc... we usually have to go by other's people's rules.. that's just life =\
Rocking the boat usually only makes things harder.
I one of the first people to say that I sure don't always conform to what society thinks as the "norm" but I also know how to express myself in a way that I don't also hinder my advancement in either school/work.... I know to pick my battles!

[QUOTE=alban lusitanae;183843] Yay for Democracy...

And freedom of speech and action is then robbed.
[/QUOTE]

These freedoms you talk about, why don't you apply them to the 14 year old sister with condoms in her room. Why do you think there should be a mandatory sex age? Seems to me you pick interests which suit you. Maybe you had a sudden pang of morality. You sound like a politician.

Make a mockery out of the very Country I defend in the military, you have no shame. Yay, for Democracy we are a world power here in the USA.

The US ED system has issues but think about protesting and voting out your government officials for accepting US Financial Funding during the wildfires you had in Portugal a few years back.

We didn't have to over throw communism to have democracy--A. Cunhal in 1974. We have always had our basic values based on a Democratic nation.

[quote]Obviously you hate the US.[/quote]

Huh? what? what gave you that idea?! Just because I criticize a country, or my own, I hate it?! I'm not allowed to criticize?

[quote]When one understands how the government works both in politics and administration there is a better option to change.[/quote]

Read my post again. I said the answer is changing the system and not to act in the system. You chose to work in the system. That's ok. I don't do that, that's all.

[quote]When you have studied the issues presently before the education boards, it's not about "being a good boy". It's how to suit an entire population as a whole. Understanding the current issues of school violence, sexual harassment, etc has a trade off with expelling students which are problematic; thus, increasing the uneducated portion of the population widening class systems gaps. There is freedom of speech & freedom of actions but life does hold boundry's for all; there are rules in life and kids need to learn them the same as adults. One can not do as they wish all the time. I find it ironic how you can comment on such issues when you are not currently involved in them here in the US.[/quote]

Oh I see. So if we aren't of the USA we can't criticize. Brilliant. Why don't you make this a completely american forum then? You seem to have a problem with people who have different views and opinions, because they live in different countries. I don't think that's very correct. And I'm sorry, "no touching" rules are supposed to be taking serious? I think you have to solve your violence issues some other way, not with this rules. They aren't going to solve anything.

[quote]however, when one has stood in the aftermath/shambles of 9-11, a definitive action was necessary.[/quote]

What? what does 9/11 has to do with anything?! Now that's an excuse for every action?

[quote]It's ironic, I do try to understand other's ways of life and have an appreciation for it, weather I agree with it or not. I do try not to insult those unlike myself regardless of their religion or their political beliefs.[/quote]

Not insulting anyone. Criticizing, and I can do it with everything, I'm free to do it. So are you and anyone here. You have criticized me and my views. Seeing me having a problem with that? :) Criticize me. Debate. That's why we're here for.

[quote]I am merely attempting to explain a system which I have formally studied for years to someone who has no appreciation nor willingness to wish to learn about it.[/quote]

FYI, we have a discipline called Introduction to Politics in our junior high. I work on the TV network and I am a technical translator. I KNOW your system. I just don't like it, and yes, I don't appreciate it, but that does not mean I don't understand it. On the contrary. But again, not accepting that someone has a different view and attempting to classify every different opinion has an insult... well...

[quote]I agree that it's extreme to not allow hand shakes or High 5s, but this kid knew about the "no touching" rule and yet he still put his arm around his g/f.[/quote]

Granted. Have no argument against that. Following question: what's wrong with his atittude? What sin has the kid commited?

[quote]Even if it has nothing to do w/ violence...maybe it'll be an end to things like 5th graders having sex in classroom[/quote]

So... to end 5th grade classroom sex we should abolish touching? Is that it? That's a quantum leap in logic IMHO.

[quote]Or there was another thread where a girl who's 12 said she'd given HJs in class before. Rules aren't strict until people start taking advantage of the mild/moderate rules they have in place.[/quote]

Do you honestly believe the no touching rules are going to stop kids from doing anything? It starts in the HOME, not in SCHOOL. If the kids are raised right, and not let alone to their own devices, something that Sera said in other posts and I totally agree, things might change.

[quote]Like at my work... some people have been taking advantage and leaving early/ coming in late...long lunches..etc.... so now they are wanting to enforce stricter rules about time/attendance. Now if those people had performed w/in the limits set...then it wouldn't have been a problem...it's when you try to go outside the limits...that they become more strict.[/quote]

So, when there is a problem, impose ever increasing control and stricter rules. When are you telling the young girls to use Burkhas then? Don't you see? You are fast on the track to that. Doesn't take much.

[quote]And yes we all have freedoms of speech and expression...but then when we are in school...at work...etc... we usually have to go by other's people's rules.. that's just life =\[/quote]

No we don't. If you think that way, you are not a citizen. You're followining rules blindly, without trying to change them. I'm sorry you have delegated you free thinking in someone else. I truly am...

[quote]Rocking the boat usually only makes things harder. [/quote]

You know, you're starting to creep me out with this display of utter terror of change... fight for it. And I don't mean take arms in the fire mode sense...

[quote]I one of the first people to say that I sure don't always conform to what society thinks as the "norm" but I also know how to express myself in a way that I don't also hinder my advancement in either school/work.... I know to pick my battles![/quote]

You already lost the war, my friend. I'm sad you think that way, honestly. There are no battles to pick, because the battles you fight won't matter to change anything...

[Quote]These freedoms you talk about, why don't you apply them to the 14 year old sister with condoms in her room. [/quote]

5th grader with an arm on shoulder vs. 14 y.o. with dildo and condoms...yes, it's the same situation, I can see it now...

I did apply freedom of choice. If she was doing it to know her body, I said and quote "Here's my advice mate. Talk to her and tell her what you found. Tell her that you are not judging, and that she is right about knowing her body and discovering it and there is nothing wrong with it. Having real sex so soon is not.". I sustain that having sex so soon it's wrong. However, no touching rules is not going to stop 5th graders to have sex if they want to and that's a fact.

[quote]Why do you think there should be a mandatory sex age? [/quote]

Because very young people should know their bodies well and understand the implications of sex for a long time before they do it with someone else. That includes 5th graders of course. But again, no touching ruels (the topic, remember that) will not change anything, it might actually do worse.

[quote]Seems to me you pick interests which suit you. Maybe you had a sudden pang of morality. You sound like a politician. [/quote]

? Did I forget to reply to anyone? Did I forget to reply to any of your questions? Don't understand where this is coming from...

[quote]Make a mockery out of the very Country I defend in the military, you have no shame. Yay, for Democracy we are a world power here in the USA.[/quote]

So, you're argumenting about my mockery (wherever you got that idea) by replying that you are a military officer and the USA is a world (military) power? Not a good argument.

[quote]The US ED system has issues but think about protesting and voting out your government officials for accepting US Financial Funding during the wildfires you had in Portugal a few years back.[/quote]

I did. And also sent pictures to the authorities about aircraft dropping incendiary granades (you know how it works obviously) in the forests. They did nothing, because they are corrupt and take money from companies who want to:

- make turistic settlements
- buy wood at lower prices (burned wood)
- clear land for large areas of Eucalyptus globulus Labil, trees that grow much faster and higher profit.

You think I'm attacking the USA? Ok. Here goes: I think that the portuguese government is the most corrupt government in Europe, above Italy. See? I criticize my country as well. And I don't see it as betraying my motherland. Not doing or saying anything is.

[quote]I doubt the US government is going to change the political system to suit you, me, or anyone else for that matter. It's the system which our country is founded upon.

We didn't have to over throw communism to have democracy--A. Cunhal in 1974. We have always had our basic values based on a Democratic nation.[/quote]

Actually, our democracy is going down fast, but that's another topic.

Rdan, you're military. I respect the military more than you could probably believe. However, you follow orders. The only laws that apply to you are the commanding hierarchy, and the rules of engagement. If these rules of engagement dictate that you have to place yourself into a bomber and go to other countries and bomb them, you are not supposed to think about the orders. You are suppose to follow them. Going against the orders everytime you received them, you couldn't be a good soldier. You would second guess every action you took and that would get you killed.

However, the system you don't see changing and don't believe will change would change if people took more action to change it and not follow the line of "this wil never change so might as well conform". I'm sure you are a fine soldier and love your country, but you have to understand that a system can always be better and no one is going to change the system from the inside. That's a fallacy. People on the system (meaning inside the society which has the system) must conform and not stir too much or, as Buttercup said, suffer the consequences. That's not democracy, when you have to make silent influences inside the system like a petty conspirator to try to change anything (which you don't), instead of having freedom to speak out without being afraid to be expelled, fired ou fired upon. :)

LOL no problem mate :D

Alban:

The only thing I can say to you, you have no clear understanding about life in the US. A high school course is nice but live here and you can understand we are not repressed, that is you perception. The media is full of trash, not believable on many topics since they also "spin". For every reason our system does not work, it is in fact working. If it was so awful here, people would be moving out of the US, the point of the parent getting media attention was to draw public interest to a topic they cared about.

very well that's your point of view :) we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one :)

[QUOTE]So... to end 5th grade classroom sex we should abolish touching? Is that it? That's a quantum leap in logic IMHO.
[/QUOTE]
Like I said... it didn't start out like that, One didn't equal the other...but kids keep pushing!! and pushing!!!! till things DO get to that point.

[QUOTE]Do you honestly believe the no touching rules are going to stop kids from doing anything? It starts in the HOME, not in SCHOOL. If the kids are raised right, and not let alone to their own devices, something that Sera said in other posts and I totally agree, things might change.
[/QUOTE]

It might not stop them from doing things at home...but it would much cut down what they might be doing at school. And for kids who are like 12, unless they live in a certain town where everyone lives in the same neighborhood, or take public transportation...then school might be the only time they see their "g/f b/f" unless on the weekends.. so yeah they probably wouldn't be doing as much.

[QUOTE]So, when there is a problem, impose ever increasing control and stricter rules. When are you telling the young girls to use Burkhas then? Don't you see? You are fast on the track to that. Doesn't take much.
[/QUOTE]
So what do people usually do when you break the rules??

[QUOTE]No we don't. If you think that way, you are not a citizen. You're followining rules blindly, without trying to change them. I'm sorry you have delegated you free thinking in someone else. I truly am...[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]You know, you're starting to creep me out with this display of utter terror of change... fight for it. And I don't mean take arms in the fire mode sense...
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]You already lost the war, my friend. I'm sad you think that way, honestly. There are no battles to pick, because the battles you fight won't matter to change anything...[/QUOTE]

The war is coming in late to work/leaving early/and taking long lunches???
Ok that was just an example and I could care less b/c I am usually to work on time,and I take lunches whenever... geeesh. I leave early every night tho.

About rocking the boat...is what I meant when you stay under the radar... don't leave early right in front of the boss/supervisor. I work nights so NO ONE is even around when I leave...

Oh we fight back at work and bitch...we are in the proces of it right now... so we'll see how that turns out.

But like I said...there are times when you have to choose your battles. Say when it comes to expressing yourself in how you look. Maybe you like to have tats, piercings, crazy colored hair. Ok... that's all well and good...and I used to dye my hair wild and I never had piercings/tats only b/c I was chicken it would hurt too much...not b/c I didn't want one lol.

OK so what if I get through college (where it doesn't matter what you look like or how you behave...unlike public school). One you pay for yourself...the other the state pays for...hmmmm.....

Anyways, I get out of college...looking for a job... so you think I should show up to my job interview w/ blue hair, lip ring, etc. Yes it's sad that people are judged by the way they look...but in a "professional" world...sometimes you must ACT like an adult and be responsible.
The whole work thing isn't really about them being strict on us... it's that acting like a slacker is for kids/teens...when you become an adult you should act like one!!!!
But I believe stances on appearance are becoming more accepted since that the generations that were getting piercings/tats are now moving into the higher up positions.

[QUOTE]5th grader with an arm on shoulder vs. 14 y.o. with dildo and condoms...yes, it's the same situation, I can see it now...

I did apply freedom of choice. If she was doing it to know her body, I said and quote "Here's my advice mate. Talk to her and tell her what you found. Tell her that you are not judging, and that she is right about knowing her body and discovering it and there is nothing wrong with it. Having real sex so soon is not.". I sustain that having sex so soon it's wrong. However, no touching rules is not going to stop 5th graders to have sex if they want to and that's a fact.
[/QUOTE]

The 14 yr old had condoms...no dildo...she was having sex...not masturbating...and yes if a kid has a g/f then most likely they'll be having sex soon... but less at least hope they won't be having it AT school.

I mean I have never been to Portugal and have no idea how their government is run.
I don't agree w/ a lot of the things that our country does either...but I vote and do what I can. If you don't vote...DON"T BITCH! lol
Only rules I don't really agree w/ here have to do w/ drugs and how they treat people convicted w/ drugs....like they murdered someone...but that is a WHOLE other topic.
For the most part, I do whatever I want... like when it comes to our daily lives. School is so strict b/c that is a state funded, publicly ran institution...colleges are nothing like that.
I mean I could break rules such as stealing/hurting someone/ driving too fast/ but I mean what's the point?

I think the part which is being missed is; here in the US educators are being faced with gangs running the schools. They will walk up to another student facing them put their arm around their neck (like a hug) and knife them. It's a sad state when you have metal detectors, police patrolling the school halls, and kids with ankle bracelets on (home jail) attending the same schools where kids are just trying to get a decent education.

These kids obviously have no parental supervision! But as soon as they are expelled, now a whole group is alienated, the ACLU screams about the disparate treatment of those who have home issues. Other schools have ladies being raped in the bathroom. This is the issue which is not conveyed.

[quote]Like I said... it didn't start out like that, One didn't equal the other...but kids keep pushing!! and pushing!!!! till things DO get to that point.[/quote]

well, yeah, but ever increasing repression won't cut it. :/ repression can only go so far before it actually becomes an incentive.

[quote]It might not stop them from doing things at home...but it would much cut down what they might be doing at school. And for kids who are like 12, unless they live in a certain town where everyone lives in the same neighborhood, or take public transportation...then school might be the only time they see their "g/f b/f" unless on the weekends.. so yeah they probably wouldn't be doing as much.[/quote]

hmmmmmm, maybe. Not sure, but maybe.

[quote]So what do people usually do when you break the rules?[/quote]

You punish in a correct way. I wouldn't know what punishment would be applied here since I don't view this as being a breaking of the rules, because the rule shouldn't exist IMHO.

[quote]The war is coming in late to work/leaving early/and taking long lunches?[/quote]

Nononononono accepting everything without attempting to change what's wrong, or attempting to change it from inside the system that doesn't care about you or isn't going to be affected no matter what you do (because you're acting inside the system).

[quote]But like I said...there are times when you have to choose your battles. Say when it comes to expressing yourself in how you look. Maybe you like to have tats, piercings, crazy colored hair. Ok... that's all well and good...and I used to dye my hair wild and I never had piercings/tats only b/c I was chicken it would hurt too much...not b/c I didn't want one lol.[/quote]

Well, I was thinking more of a global / national level, but if you change too much to have a job or be respected in school, maybe you are taking your personality away... But I was actually talking about national level and changing laws to let people live better and stuff :)

[quote]Anyways, I get out of college...looking for a job... so you think I should show up to my job interview w/ blue hair, lip ring, etc. Yes it's sad that people are judged by the way they look...but in a "professional" world...sometimes you must ACT like an adult and be responsible. The whole work thing isn't really about them being strict on us... it's that acting like a slacker is for kids/teens...when you become an adult you should act like one!!!! But I believe stances on appearance are becoming more accepted since that the generations that were getting piercings/tats are now moving into the higher up positions.[/quote]

wait wait wait. I understand you are speaking of freedom of speech, but my idea was more on the process of education and repression by law. Social repression will always exist due to society and majority religious groups rules and laws. You are correct in what you say, but let's go back to the topic, the kids. When you are 15+ y.o., you have more responsability and have to act on it, but kids? 5th graders? hmmmmmmmm doesn't glue the theory of repressing 5th graders for touching someone...

[quote]I mean I have never been to Portugal and have no idea how their government is run.[/quote]

Badly.

[quote]I think the part which is being missed is; here in the US educators are being faced with gangs running the schools. They will walk up to another student facing them put their arm around their neck (like a hug) and knife them. It's a sad state when you have metal detectors, police patrolling the school halls, and kids with ankle bracelets on (home jail) attending the same schools where kids are just trying to get a decent education.[/quote]

But Sera, I continue to ask: will no touching rules change anything of this which you so clearly and rightly presented? No, it won't. It's a stupid rule.

[Quote]These kids obviously have no parental supervision! But as soon as they are expelled, now a whole group is alienated, the ACLU screams about the disparate treatment of those who have home issues. Other schools have ladies being raped in the bathroom. This is the issue which is not conveyed.[/quote]

Precisely! In here, professors have been attacked by students. But no touching rules are not going to change it! Gangs ruling schools is a social problem that needs to be addressed in the proper forums, not imposing ridiculous rules. Let's face it: 5th graders who wish to touch each other will leave the school and start touching on the school door!

The governments must act in a serious matter and eliminate the causes of the gangs existance, not repress kids because they do something normal of any human being. Patching rules are not going to cut it.

Alban:

The rule allows for when these unruly kids get out of hand there is a way to dismiss them from the school system which is not based upon individual or group norms; rather then violation of the policy. What this kid did was in no way wrong, in all seriousness. He was one of the good ones caught up in a bad social issue which has restrictions to serve as corrective measures.

Unlike schools in Idaho or Utah, here in NY it's wild. If one corners a girl against a locker, gropes her breast or rump, then the sexual assault has occurred. In some areas, based on geography, the gangs are out of control and it's nearing requiring a "military state" to control some behaviors. To help keeping these kids in school is one of the few alternatives since the only authority structure they have are the school system & probation officers. Some make it out (of their horrible life), some don't and are condemned to a life of prison.

Until the situation is managed on a greater level, overall through the government finding a way to dis-ban the groups, the only way to allow some to be educated is to put forth very strict rules, according to educators. There is constantly a thought process of rehabing these kids, until this stops and they are removed from the system & "mainstreaming"; there is no clear solution to repairing a broken system.

We have 14 year olds carrying hand guns to school, switch blade knifes, etc. And who suffers? The ones who just want a decent education. Years back there was a movie about a principal who went into a school system to reform it. I cannot remember the name of it or the actor but I remember thinking; glad we have never come to this behavior & now yet we have. In order to give some social equity, fairness & liberties it's taken that much from other's. The US is protecting the freedoms of the wrong individuals, robbing the good ones of fairness. If I had kids, they would not be in a public education system, it would be private or nothing. I would never allow my kids to be subjected to integration as it currently exists.

Maybe you were talking of Dangerous Minds

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112792/

Anyway, that's a sad situation. Someone is bound to get caught on the bad site of things. And then there's no turning back :/

I believe that is the one, where the teacher was assaulted and while out on leave there was an attempt to take back the school, although it was hypothetical, it was a sad state.

When spin off behavior of gangs became predominant here, they had a right to assemble and to belong to groups as they deemed fit. During this time, I worked in a community hospital, this was about 1998 or so. During a gang shooting a "friend" of the patient wanted to ask some questions. We went in to a vacant trauma room to chat. I was put up against a wall by him at knife point, as he began to make a cut in my neck, my foot hit a garbage container. One of the guys I worked with heard it (was an off duty cop working in the ER for extra money) ran in and disarmed him. The "take down" was not pleasant, weapon secured, taken off by the cops. The hospitals response to "protect" the staff was to place us under lock down during trauma rather then deal with the issue. I wound up being sued with the hospital for not recognizing he was upset and suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder. Defended my actions in court, he lost, I quit nursing for a few years and returned to college. And the pinnacle of this whole issue is this was just a small geographic area, not NYC! These are similar issues with Ed boards. It's a sad state of affairs when the criminals have more a freedom then the non-criminals. How to change the system? This is why I pursued a Master of Public Administration and completed the Nurse Practitioner's program to return to helping other's yet being safe. Many laugh it's (being a Nurse Practitioner then a RN) a "white bread world" but damned it's much safer right now.

How retarded. I'd definitely be protesting this if I were the parents.

If the rule is laid out, and so are the consequences, suck it up and take responsibility for your actions. Now if the kid didn't know about the rule, that's another matter of why didn't he.

[QUOTE=Newtolove;183802]what is the world coming too the school said it is to keep order well hm I find that hard to beleive not even a hand shake

http://www.yahoo.com/s/611170[/QUOTE]

Too much "political correctness" bull**** and paranoia. People can be so damn retarded....

this PC **** is just driving me nuts. i really wish all the PC hacks would just sit down and shut up

I try to be politically correct in most of what I say and do. However, this just really takes the cake. How dumb.