The news has not been good lately. Besides Cain and his "family values", The Pennsylvania State University committed a felony in 2002 when everyone did NOT call 911. Failure to Report a Felony is in itself a felony. Sad to say, my alma mater, there was a witness you will remember, Failed to Report. Heads will now roll - as they certainly should. There is no excuse.
The reason, I bring this up here, is that each of us has a responsibility to promote sex properly and to give the wisest advice we can based upon the information received. For myself, I will no longer abide by the policy of Implied Consent. Consent must be absolute, unequivable, and given when sober after due forethought. This may make the process more fraught but sex is for adults who are capable of making rational decisions and responsible choices.
After all this time - have we learned nothing?
[QUOTE=EvilEvilKitten;275380]
After all this time - have we learned nothing?[/QUOTE]
I guess not. And I don't think it's going to stop anytime soon.
[QUOTE=EvilEvilKitten;275380]Cain is a strutting peacock of a man now reaping the rewards of being in the limelight and of believing his own press. I am not at all surprised by the allegations. Same pattern as Kobe Bryant, Tiger Woods - et. al. You've seen it a hundred times at least.[/QUOTE]
In the case of Kobe and Tiger, their acts of cheating was consensual. And even they owned up to their actions eventually. But not Cain. He's a predator and it doesn't look like he'll ever admit his mistakes.
The lesson is: CALL 911.
But it doesn't change the fact that the head coach still KNEW about and that none of them called the police. Everyone who knew about this should be fired for good.
I have to disagree eek. The witness first told his dad then joe. After that joe told his superiors(athletic director and penn state president) who didn't go to the police. I believe that is why the director and president have been charged.
Sorry, big, but in NOT telling the cops, Joe Paterno also committed a crime - one of ommission. Nice man but he too made a fundamental mistake.
Intoxicated persons are incapable of giving consent. I would not call it rape but it is taking unfair advantage to the point where he/she who 'takes' makes him/herself UNCLEAN, DISHONORABLE and LESS than human - even if it is college.
Yes I agree with you big916,that if someone is extremely intoxicated their consent should not be seen as valid.Therefore it could be construed as rape if sexual acts occur,as the person involved is not in a fit state to give consent.There have been cases in my country where footballers/elite athletes have been at parties and they have had sex with intoxicated women who have later had them charged with rape.In several of these cases the perpetrator has been acquitted as the other person even while drunk gave consent.I really don't see how consent can be seen as being given whilst in this state.
It is rather unfortunate that joepa(penn state's football coach) was wrongfully fired due to damage control by the board of trustees. Most likely he couldn't have done anything more to help the situation. The witness of the crime told joe and He told the athletic director and president. After that they did not tell the police, so they were rightfully arrested. Hopefully joe will be back mentoring these young men as he has been for decades.
EEK-your new policy reminded me of a group of college students advocating that someone can not give consent to sex while drinking alcohol. Therefore making many sexual encounters in college rape by their standards. Do you believe this to be true? And what does everyone else think about this?
Have to agree with RR here.Many victims of sexual abuse don't report it for fear of being called a liar or being labelled "easy".The "she asked for it" defence or similar disgust me."No" means just that.Have to concur with EEK that implied consent may put someone in very hot water.If I don't hear the word "Yes" then it's a no go zone. Example:I ask my partner would he/she like me to perform a certain act.They may say "you know I like it".But I reply "do you want me to?"Maybe doesn't cut the mustard.It has to be YES or nothing.
I suffered from sexual abuse as a child,at the hands of a relative.It was never reported because the offender (my uncle)was only a few years older than me,and that whole his word vs yours really stands out.He used to tell me "they won't believe you",or you will be sent to a home for girls.I was between the ages of 8-15,my uncle 13-20 at the time of the abuse.The sentencing for sexual abuse crimes in Australia is minimal compared to other countries.In many instances a suspended sentence or community service is given.It's another reason for a victim not wanting to report the crime.It really isn't worth being dragged "through the mud" for and everyone sees you in a "different light".You are forever labelled as "that girl who accused so and so of raping her".
Then Cain is a 'small man' in every sense of the word. You're right about Woods and Bryant being consensual - but calling their attitudes "entitled" remains appropriate.
[QUOTE=Firmus;275392]The Cain one is such hogwash. Why do things like this always pop up way later, only when someone is in the limelight? Because they're looking for some hangers on fame I believe. I figure if it did t bother her for the last 14 years to press charges then it shouldn't bother her to bring it up now.
I'm not meaning this as disrespect to women or anything. Its just why would you sit on a claim like this for so long? There's also no mention of what leads up to this. With all we've read, it's just as likely she was flirting with him first. There's just not enough detail. Plus who remembers a 14 year old event correctly? That's plenty of time for personal feelings and whatnot to skew details.[/QUOTE]
It's not simple like that Firmus. The reason why this took so long was that Cain had given at least two of the victims a huge settlement to stay quiet. Also, Cain had also violated the non disclosure agreement he had with the victims which is why so many women are now speaking out against.
Not only that, but a lot of the victims are afraid of their reputation and are just trying to get their lives back which is one of the reasons why stuff like this often doesn't get reported in the first place. Most likely some of these women were forced against their will by their lawyers to come forward when this story broke.
And this isn't just two women we're talking about here. There's FIVE. Not only that but a male co worker came out as a witness saying that this stuff was going on all the time. If all these women were flirting with Cain, why didn't he say so instead of changing his story?
This also, Firmus, points out WHY men in particular need to be careful - because any infraction can come back and bite you when you least want it to come to light...WILL.
Cain is a strutting peacock of a man now reaping the rewards of being in the limelight and of believing his own press. I am not at all surprised by the allegations. Same pattern as Kobe Bryant, Tiger Woods - et. al. You've seen it a hundred times at least.
Frankly, the only thing such men do is make it harder for the rest of you men.
Regardless of the exact example, many aspects make a victim not press charges. You feel ashamed and disgusted with yourself (even though you shouldn't). You have more issues coping with "what on earth did just happen to me?!" than you have strength to make it through trial. You know offenders only suffer minor penalty, making the trial more like punishing yourself reliving it (even though you should nail the bastard). And when there's the "victory", then there's the whole world knowing you were "violated". It's insane how it stigmatizes you if you've ever been victim- society needs a serious check-up and kick when it comes to that. And if you lose the trial -say: too little evidence, his vs her story, too little detail- then there's an even longer road ahead of you. I haven't even mentioned situations in which you depend on your offender for your salary or other dominating positions or even emotional bonds. Need I go on?
I encourage any victim to press charges. How else will we change this twisted system and punish the offenders??? If we'd stand up as one, instead of hiding alone, we could find our strength. But I understand if victims feel they can't handle it. Or if they can't handle it right now. Turn the point of view: if it is still worth accusing him after all those years, then it must still be a very big deal to this woman.
I can assure you, even after many years the memory will be clear. In fact; it may take a while before you're ready to accept it happened. It's amazing how your mind is somehow equiped with a stop&pauze-button, particularly when the memory is horrendious and traumatic enough to protect yourself from it.
I don't know the exact story -and not much interested in digging my way through dirt and gossip- but I can imagine now the perfect opportunity has rissen for the victim to make the offender suffer most. Striking him at his most precious of times. While she has had her time to get over the first shock and feels furious with her offender's head on tv. Even drawing her strength from it. Her energy further boosted by the fact she isn't his only victim. His fall will make the suffering and reliving she's going through now worthwhile.
There's one little bug. That there will always be people who see an opportunity to make money, making up a story that never happened. Those people disgust me as they are raping real victims again.
The Cain one is such hogwash. Why do things like this always pop up way later, only when someone is in the limelight? Because they're looking for some hangers on fame I believe. I figure if it did t bother her for the last 14 years to press charges then it shouldn't bother her to bring it up now.
I'm not meaning this as disrespect to women or anything. Its just why would you sit on a claim like this for so long? There's also no mention of what leads up to this. With all we've read, it's just as likely she was flirting with him first. There's just not enough detail. Plus who remembers a 14 year old event correctly? That's plenty of time for personal feelings and whatnot to skew details.