Well done!!!

monie i was just about to comment..

Oh my god you guys just shutup. You all need to get over yourselves. Its beyond pathetic already!

And to Marianna- I'm glad you were brave enough to get help. Good luck in everything you do in life and remember, none of this is your fault.

I did make a comment

But, thank you so much for reminding me to wish Marianna good luck and to stay strong.

Oh and Lilly good to see you are able to see the error of your ways on this thread and so willing to change. A good example for us all to follow.

[QUOTE=Quote (lilly2279 @ May 24 2005,09:39)]Too bad someone had to try and make a final little dig, but oh well.[/QUOTE]
Oh, like you just did?

Trying to get back on track.

Thank you so much for updating us!  i am glad you are getting help and that all is well!

At least things are being worked out for you!  It will all work out in the end and just be a distant memory.  You have nothing to regret and were extremely brave!  

We were all very concerned about you.  I'm so glad you checked back!

Thank you mod for putting the thread back on track!  I know once I edited my posts to try and get back on track, I messed with the flow a bit.  

Thank you, Marianna. I am happy to hear your news and your assurance that I did nothing wrong, although I'm not sure I agree with you. As you were surprised by other's interest in you and your problem, I was surprised by certain people's anger and self-centeredness.

But I am not surprised that things are going well. It was clear from your post that you a mature intelligent person who just needed a couple of nudges to get past the situation. You'll be fine!

Marianna,
I'm relieved and proud that you had the strength to deal with your situation. That took great courage on your part.

I know you and your father must be having a rough time right now. I pray that in time you can both have a healthy father/daughter relationship. I wish you both well.

Take care.

Good for you Marianna. I am so glad to hear that you are both taking the initiative to work this out, thank you for giving us an update!

-Mariah

About the only difference I notice is some of the hero worshiping is gone….you can interpret that as u wish

I found nothing offensive about your post at all.

[QUOTE=Quote (finewine @ May 22 2005,11:46)]I found nothing offensive about your post at all.[/QUOTE]
Did you read it "pre-moderated"...?

I agree... there was nothing worth editing out... but apparently, others disagree. It's saddening since there are so many nice people here... but if I find this to become a more common practice, then I can assure you I will not be frequenting this forum in the future.

Once the "offending" (and off-topic posts) were removed, the other posts relating to them were out of context and also would have been very confusing to any new reader. That is why all posts relating to the matter were removed. It is not about any one person being singled out ... or not being supportive of more tolerant posts.

Some people want everyone's posts editing, except their own ... others don't want any posts editing ... others want ... well, you get the idea.

Other people don't like being offended, but see nothing wrong with being offensive in return ... and on it goes ...

We do try not to censor and to allow as much freedom of speech as possible ... but that occasionally has it's price.

As my grandmother said "you can please all the people some of the time, some of the people all the time, but never all the people all of the time!"

[QUOTE=Quote (moderator @ May 22 2005,14:05)]....{moderator's post}...

Edited by moderator on May 22 2005,14:22 [/QUOTE]
LOL.  
Et tu Brute?

[QUOTE=Quote (moderator @ May 21 2005,21:24)]A significant number of posts have been edited or deleted from this topic relating to inappropriate content.[/QUOTE]
Ummm... why was MY post editd...? What was offensive, questionable or inappropriate about it...???

I was making a relevant point about people's reactions... and that part has been removed.

Not sure if I plan on returning to this site much more if this is going to be the normal practice.

I have no PM with an explanation or anything. Disappointing indeed.

A significant number of posts have been edited or deleted from this topic relating to inappropriate content.

I will say this...
In my experience... this kind of thing of the original post does happen.

I can only hope that the girl, in her pain of heart and mind, focused and acted on Wally's advice AND ANY OTHER advice from this board TELLING HER TO SEEK PROFESSIONAL help .
It is after all, her pain of heart and mind.
It is after all her post.
It is not ours.

Like you, I hope the original topic was BS, altho I think it was not.

WOW! I hate being this late to a party!

(Note: I don't REALLY think this topic is a party, but man... a lot has gone-on.)

It's so hard to discern fact from fiction via text on a screen at times. Men post as women, people make false claims, teens post as adults, adults post as teens... Most of the time, you need to proceed on some sort of assumption of credibility.

There was(is) something about this thread that just WREAKED of "BS" from the moment I started reading it, but honestly... I couldn't tell you if this "problem" is 100% true, 80% true, 40% true... or just a pure, unadulterated fabrication for someone's amusement.

If it is actually even 80%-100% true... then there's a real issue at stake that requires professional intervention before things are irreversably damaged. There's so much "potentially" at stake for both parties... but although "chatting" on a message board is a "STEP" in her taking action... it is FAR from getting REAL help or taking REAL steps to stopping this before it get's too far to fix.

Maybe I'm wrong.. gonna go re-read it again... if there is any truth to this thread, I hope the best for her. But mostly.. I can hear the BS-Meter going of lightly in the back of my head.

Well now we're over that... umm i still wish she would come on and update us.. herself. tell us whats goin on.

I also wondered if this was all a hoax. The extra taglline saying "Dad's a turnon" is a little more than I would expect a 17 year old to say. But I guess you never know.

Brandye brings up a wonderful point though. Even if it's not real (which by all means we would hope it's not! Even though we know it does unfortunately happen!) at least it is out there for people to read for good advice.

I am going to *edit" my posts to take all of the things out that do not apply to the actual thread. I am doing this to be fair to the thread, not because I didn't feel that way.

This is ALL interesting. And I am glad that she is talking to someone. Wally may just be the chosen vehicle for information. It is surprising how many side pm's I receive and I assume many others do as well.

I somehow have the feeling that we have all been taken for a ride by someone's fertile imagination. But the situation is so much more common than most of us think. People responded with well thought out points and some of the heavy hitters (best advisors) stepped forward. Whether "she" made it all up or whether it was real, there is now a thread for someone faced with the same situaion. Usually the situation is much less gentle and consensual than this. I have treated cases, and even referred for abortion, women having sex with their fathers. Every woman was performing out of fear, wanted a way out and despised her father at the same time she was afraid of his going to jail.

It can go the other way around. In a nearby community, a woman (unmarried mother) had been kissing and sucking her son's penis since he was a baby. He did not know the difference between boys and girls and thought this a normal part of growing up. When he first ejaculated (at eleven), she got undressed. Scared the hell out of him and he went running to a neighbor screaming that his mother did not have a penis. A few messed up people?

Thank you, Brandye... the voice of reason is always good and too often lacking. Like you, I receive a number of unsolicited PMs and take them seriously and - I believe - responsibly and in adult fashion, contrary to the implications others make.

I agree, this could have been an imaginary situation, but I'm also surprised at the PMs I've received from women who've admitted similar but less intense situations in their past. If it had only been a few posts, I'd tend to think it was not true... but when people have the courage to dialog, that suggests it's real.

Also something that i have noticed about Marianna.

You say that he is a GREAT dad and a GREAT person and he takes GREAT care of you Marianna. No, this is not right. A great dad does not make out and touch his daughter. I know that it is consensual, and that you also want to touch him and make out with him. But to be quite honest, HE is in the position of power. You are 17 and you are his daughter, he is 38 and he is your father. A great father DOES NOT, under any circumstances, make out with or touch his daughter.

-Mariah

[QUOTE=Quote (moose_hd @ May 10 2005,18:35)]Just an observation here:

[QUOTE=Quote ]We were touching one another and I wanted to  so bad.  My dad finally stopped it, but I don't know, I think eventually were not gonna stop.[/QUOTE]

It's quite possible that your worries about this situation with your dad are mutual, as he is the one who stopped it on that occasion.

As to what to do, everything I can think of and a lot more has already been said.[/QUOTE]
Yeh, I want to add that I think it was good that your Dad stopped it that time.

I think you both need to step back and maybe even speak to each other about your feelings and the fact that you both reaslise what your doing isnt quite right. ( I wont say wrong, because I can understand some of your feelings to a certain extent [step father] I dont want to go into it)

Good luck with sorting this out and continuing to have a great relationship with your father in the future.

I'm glad she is talking to a 3rd party!  That is great, good news!  

Thanks Wally, I am glad to hear she is trying to get some help. Hopefully she will. No good can come out of what she has been doing. And her dad need's a good hard reality check himself.

I also know she couldn't find a better person to talk to then you and getting too many opinions on such an emotional issue could be confusing for her.

Since it is not my place to speak for her, but everyone seems concerned, I will say this. I know that she did make a call to a third party...

I'm sure we'd all like to hear the outcome, but we also need to understand that this forum (any forum) is not the best place for help with a situation like this and posting continued developments will not necessarily be helpful and might actually be unwise.

Yeah i was actually about to ask for an update. MARANNIA WHAT IS HAPPENING?

We are all worried i think.

-Mariah

Yes i agree Lilly GREAT JOB!!!

-Mariah

aww, you guys are soo nice. I just wish we would get an update on the current situation. Ugg. I hope she is staying away. It's so frightening, you know? I'm like all wrapped up in it and afraid they went all the way.

lily.. THANK YOU SWEETIE! you said all the things i was thinking and did a HELL OF A JOB!

Whew!! You've been given some absolutely excellent advice from people who mean the very best for you.

Someone mentioned the fact that you are 17 with all kinds of hormones raging. That is sooo true. You have just begun to a full fledged woman. You have got to get out of his bed. Here is something I'm wondering.. Does your father ask you to sleep in his bed? Who initiates the kissing? He is your father and he should know better. You are the child and do not know better. Because you do not have a strong female icon in your life, you are almost psychologically trying to fill in as his wife. This can't happen. It won't work. Imagine what your entire family would think?

When you are home, do NOT walk around in skimpy clothes. cover your body. He's your dad, but he's still a man. If he is unable to control his urges it is best for you not to tempt him. This may sound prissy, but I think you need to start working on turning this around before it goes too far. You know it's wrong. You may be very comforted by the relationship you have, but it needs to get cooled off a bit. Get out of his bed. Do not cuddle with him on the couch, don't look at him with that raging teenager sexual hunger.

You mentioned he has a girlfriend. What is your relationship with her? do you like her? do you feel jealous that she spends time with your father? Do they have a strong sexual relationship? I know you may not want to think you are jealous of her, but you may be on some level. You may be unknowingly tempting your father to get his attention on you instead of his girlfriend. I'm not saying you're doing any of this on purpose.

You HAVE to go talk to someone. I think at least to clear your head and let someone know how you feel. An actual professional psychologist. This electra complex is going too far. You're not sick. A lot of little girls want to grow up and marry their dads and lots of little boys want to grow up to marry their moms. They usually grow out of this once they understand their maternal and paternal relationships. You need help getting out of this. You cannot do it alone.

Your father will NOT be upset, dissapointed or mad at you if you take the stand to resume a normal loving father/daughter relationship. He will be releived that someone has been strong enough to stop it. Which is why he stopped before you went "all the way" the other night. he does not sounds like a pedophile, but he needs your help now. You have to be strong, so he can be strong, as well.

One day your father will walk you down the aisle to marry the true love of your life. Do you want that day soiled by knowing you had sex with your dad? You could never tell your husband that it would rattle him to the core.

You are brave and smart. Get working on this problem now, hon and talk to us. Let us know how things are working. Good luck.

[QUOTE=Quote (Marianna @ May 09 2005,16:11)]If it wasn't for the fact we were father and daughter, this would be the perfect relationship.  We both have the same interests.  We like the same music, we like the same movies, we both go roller blading, biking, etc...He's just everything I want in a guy.   He's great looking, fun, but I love his mind more than those things.  [/QUOTE]

Mayybe you could try looking for those qualities in other guys?

Well...i'm a bit frustrated right now.

Every single person responding to your post has urged you to STOP! But clearly you don't want to do that. Clearly you are fixated on this and just know that you do so at a peril you cannot fathom!

IF you have sex with your father: he's 38 and u are 17, here's what you risk:

1) Minimum Jail time: This is a felony and can be up to 35 or more years behind bars. Many states have mandatory sentencing.
2) A lifetime of being a "Registered Sex Offender". This means anywhere your father would move, he would have to go to the local police and register. His name, face and address would be availbe for anyone in the country (or neighborhood) to see.
3) You're ablity to enter into a mutually consensual relationship would be in jeopardy.
4) The court may prohibt your father from ever being within 100 feet of you!
5) If convicted, he would always carry the felony record and have to declare that for any job.

Is ANY of this important to you? Or do you honestly think you can live in a private little world where no one knows that you have an intimate relationship with your father? Do you really think there is any hope of a real relationship with him?

If you REALLY DO love him, you will STOP! That's all i have to say! Sorry.

I wish you good luck, its obviously a cocktail of feelings at the moment; just remember to keep your head and do the right thing

Just an observation here:

[QUOTE=Quote ]We were touching one another and I wanted to  so bad.  My dad finally stopped it, but I don't know, I think eventually were not gonna stop.[/QUOTE]

It's quite possible that your worries about this situation with your dad are mutual, as he is the one who stopped it on that occasion.

As to what to do, everything I can think of and a lot more has already been said.

You seem very focused on your Dad being in trouble. Honey, the trouble this will cause you the rest of your life is much greater than anything that would happen to him. You must take care of yourself and you are very close to, perhaps beyond, the point of no return. There must be immediate intervention or you will both wind up with some real psych problems.

You may or may not feel abused, but this would be sexual abuse. Your Dad is your Dad and that is a position of authority giving him great power over you. In excess of 20% of all women in the world have been sexually abused and most of those are by family members. These women, typically, have greater difficulty developing healthy sexual relationships with others. And god knows we all have trouble with that.

You need to talk to a counselor now...you cannot wait. In fact both of you need to see someone, maybe separetly. And you need to go live with your mother or at least with someone else. I know you don't want to, but things can get far worse if you stay under the same roof as him. I'm sorry, but that's all I can say right now. You need to stop things before they get much worse. Get help now, get professional help before it's too late.

[QUOTE=Quote (Marianna @ May 09 2005,16:11)]...A third party's advice is something I need right now.   I can't let anything happen to my dad.  I don't know what I'd do if that happened.[/QUOTE]
You are so correct that you need to involve a third party.

Since you are worried about your Dad, find that third party NOW before things go any further. There certainly could be ramifications to your Dad because of what's happened and to tell you anything less would be dishonest. But those ramifications will be far more severe if you both proceed into a full-blown sexual relationship. Remember that legal action is not the only possible implication.

In other words, if you are worried about what could happen to him because of what you are doing... think about how much worse it will be because of what you are (apparently) considering doing. Due to the difference in your ages and the fact that he has "power" over you as a parent, most people would NOT consider this a consensual relationship no matter how loudly you say it is.

A third party should help you consider these things, as well as how to extricate yourself from this situation. Do you need help finding that? I'd agree that a school counselor is not your best bet... a hotline might be a good place to start, but I think you are going need more than a conversation or two. You might use the hotline to get connected to a clinic...

Please make a call today.

There is no need to echo any of the great advice that has already been given, so I wont go there. What I do have to say (and you'll probably not like this) is that the best course of action would probably be to get out of your current living situation, as girl12 mentioned. As much as you love your dad (and arnt very close to your mom, as I understand), you are standing on the edge of a cliff here. To stay in your father's home with these kinds of feelings present (on both sides) is like playing russian roulette. As you, yourself, said.... with things left the way they are, it's only a matter of time. Get away for at least a little while and seek some professional help in the mean time. Dont worry about the consequences for your dad- your emotional and mental health is important above all things, but I'm pretty sure that as long as you havent acted upon your feelings, everything will be alright (provided you are out of the same house).

Hi Marianna.

You are 17, this is an age where you are experimenting sexually, your hormones are raging, and you are bound to try new things. In my opinion (yes it is my opinion) i think that your father should know better. You are at a very vulnerable age and I do not think that it is right for him to be supporting this attraction that you have for eachother. I think that you may have grown up with him, and you can talk to him, so there have been transfered feelings of love and sexual attraction, but, he is your father nonetheless.

I advise you not to act on your feelings for him. That is something that happens, and as you get older, you will regret it. Do not put yourself in a situation where you could engage in sexual activity with him. I think it would be better if you let this heal, maybe stay somewhere, with a friend, or with your mom, and get some help for this.

The biggest thing that i have to say is DO NOT ACT ON YOUR FEELINGS FOR HIM.

-Mariah

Whew!

First of all, I'm glad you found a place to ask your question.  I'll echo the hope that people will answer you in a compassionate and non-judgmental way.

I have some experience with unconventional relationships (gay, here), and for the most part, I'll usually say "As long as no one is being hurt, and both partners are happy, go for it", but this is a different case here.  

You aren't just talking about social norms.  There are very serious consequences to having a male/female relationship with a closely related family member.   Apart from the social judgement that you will endure should the relationship become known, there is the question of possible offspring from the relationship.   No matter how careful you might be, no method of birth control is 100%.   So you aren't just endangering yourself or your father... you are potentially harming an innocent child.

I'd suggest counselling (even some sort of hotline situation where you can remain anonymous) to help deal with your feelings.   In the meantime, please, don't place yourself in situations where you might be tempted to give in to those feelings (no more intimate kissing, no sharing a bed).

Good luck and take care.

This is an extremely difficult post to reply to in a meaningful way and with the understanding you need and deserve.

Several important points:

To an extent, your feelings for your Dad (under the circumstances) are very natural and no one should judge him or you as perverted - something that will probably happen before this thread ends. I'm not sure I can fully explain the naturalness of it except to say that there are certain roles we all have and sometimes those roles are at cross purposes and conflict.

That said, you are right to be worried. Perhaps not as much about your Dad going to jail as the long term affects of confusing the Father/Daughter roles with the partnership role you and he seem to have developed. I'm sure many Dads would welcome a deeper and closer relationship with their daughters... the bond you and he have is wonderful, but at the same time you both need to develop a perspective based on your biological relationship as well.

In the ideal situation you both would work together on that... but I don't know your Dad, and you do seem to recognize the need for some help with this. It may be that you will need to be the "adult" in your partnership with him. If you were not feeling an attraction to him, I'd suggest you ask him to help you to bring your relationship back closer to the "usual" Father/Daughter. Frankly, I'm inclined to think that will not work since he appears to be as "involved" as you.

One bit of somewhat over simplified advice is that you start putting some physical distance between you while you sort out the issues around your relationship. You definitely should not be sleeping with him, clothed or not. If the kissing is non-sexual (on the cheek) fine - if not that should change as well.

To some extent, this is about being intellectually and emotionally intimate without allowing the desire for physical intimacy to follow. A great Dad (how fortunate you have been to have one!) does not make a good lover.

I want you to find someone to talk to (like what I want is really important LOL)... some one who will not judge you and someone who will help you understand and cope with this difficult situation. Do you live in a metropolitan area where you could approach someone with anonymity?

Thank you for posting this... it took courage. It will also take courage to deal with the issues.

I'll echo Oberon and Wally in giving you big kudo's for posting here on SexInfo101 - this is proof that young adults do need a place to go to get information, support and opinions on a full spectrum of issues.

Now, to Marianna's post and question. I have re-read your post and after the 3rd time i will offer my thoughts.

1) At 17 and having almost NO experience in relationships, i'm not sure you can definatly say [QUOTE=Quote ]I can tell he really wants to touch me.[/QUOTE]

Can you please tell us a bit about how you came to live with your father?

My gut is telling me that you may be reading alot more into this than may be there. Depending on how you came to live with him, there may be alot of "overcompensation" being applied to your relationship with your Father. He wants ot make sure you know that he loves you and no matter who he dates that you're not going to be pushed to the side. And you're giving back to him to make sure that he knows that you're there to love and support him - without your mom in his life anymore. This is a complex emotional dynamic and i'm sure that you're confusion is based more on perception as opposed to reality.

2) You are VERY SMART TO BE CONCERNED! No matter if this is all in your mind - or his.......there is absolutly no question that even considering any real intimacy between you 2 could mean permanent separation - jail, state custody, public humiliation for you both.

If it sounds like i'm trying to "scare you" - I am.

I have no doubt that you're feeling feels very real! But the REAL reality, is that that there's a good chance that you're preceiving more than is there.

As was posted before, i would no longer sleep in the same bed as your father, i would keep my "kisses" to pecks on the cheek or forehead and just enjoy your time together as father and daughter. Don't let your closeness be confused with intimacy.