[QUOTE=Quote ] One thing I have learned on this site... debating the advice given is rarely productive. I've actually had requests from one poster that I not state it when I disagree her, something I actually find incredibly funny.[/QUOTE]

learned? I haven’t heard any reports that hell froze over, but maybe my news is a few days out of date.

Nothing related to this topic but why does this board insist on telling me that I have replied to this topic when I haven't till this reply here?

*looks at it funny*

[QUOTE=Quote (WallyLlama @ Sep. 12 2005,06:16)]One thing I have learned on this site... debating the advice given is rarely productive. I've actually had requests from one poster that I not state it when I disagree her, something I actually find incredibly funny.[/QUOTE]
Is it just me, or does this sentence totally contradict itself?

It is unproductive to debate someone else's advice. So there's no point in doing it. And people on here wanting to give advice, don't want other people posting just to disagree with them. That makes perfect sense to me.

Unless someone just goes totally off the wall with weird or dangerous advice, then we just have to put up with it.

Startingover - Call him. Talk this over with him. Tell him you know plenty of MANLY men who love a little finger play. but if it's not his cup of tea, then that's fine. Then you just go from there.

[QUOTE=Quote (WallyLlama @ Sep. 12 2005,03:16)]One thing I have learned on this site... debating the advice given is rarely productive.[/QUOTE]
Really?  Learned that have you?  Then why do you do it?

You could have quite easily reiterated the point about communication... which had already been made.  However, instead you state (incorrectly) that anyone who says he doesn't like anal stimulation is portrayed to be a homophobe or anti-gay.  I don't know of anyone on this board who would suggest that.

There is a world of difference in "I don't like it." (like your oral sex example) and "I liked it, but I think it's 'unmanly'" (which is what Startingover said).  No one should feel compelled into doing something they don't like.  Conversely, no one should give up something they enjoy because of incorrect preconceived ideas.

One thing I have learned on this site... debating the advice given is rarely productive. I've actually had requests from one poster that I not state it when I disagree her, something I actually find incredibly funny.

I will, however, clarify my points on occasion. My point in the original reply is that this original post was just as likely not about prostrate massage and homophobia as it has become. On another thread, we find a post by a guy who's girlfriend doesn't seem to enjoy oral (also endorsed by many) and won't let him try it. Does that make her a "lesbian-phobe?" After all, oral is what gay women do, isn't it?

In terms of "advice," both of these problems are about communication and relationships, not a politicial agenda. And, another harsh reality is that if we grant the guy in question is a homophobe, that doesn't sound the death knell of his relationship with Startingover unless she so chooses. He doesn't have to adopt a pro-gay stance to have an effective relationship with a woman.

Historically, the concept of walking in another's moccasins has been widely promoted as a way to understand. The problem that isn't so widely aknowledged is that it's damn tough to do that. We don't change all our clothes and we end up projecting our own likes and fears, expecting the owner of the moccasins to be like us.

It may be apparent that I have a thing about labels... they are certainly necessary but they are most often inaccurate when applied with a broad brush and they allow us to become mentally lazy. Instead of understanding someone, we merely say "Oh, he's a homophobe" (or whatever) as if that explains all his behavior.

As for the communication problem, I maintain that there is really no such thing as a communication problem involving one person (in this case him). If Startingover wants to maintain the relationship, I steadfastly maintain that the best solution to this problem is to worry less about his sexual preferences and figure out how to get a good dialog going about the all of the sexual issues between them.

Wally- In order to answer a post, I need to be able to identify with the situation. That being said, I also have no interest in giving or receiving anal. In fact, I had never heard of prostate massage until reading about it on this site. The fact that so many endorse it as being very pleasurable, does however, make me curious. I would be willing to try it now. Before I read about it, maybe not.

Now let's take a look at what startingover states in her post and put ourselves in his moccasins:

1)"He is gone now, and I started dating another man seriously a year ago."

We've been dating for a year.

2)"In this relationship I have not been aggressive, and I am bored. I talked about it with him this week and he agreed to be more open."

Here's some communication from my girlfriend about trying new things.

3)"He prides himself on his action in the bedroom and I don't want to burst his bubble, so I gently talked to him about new things."

I'm really satisfying her in bed, but she is still communicating about trying new things.

4)"I recently did prostate messaging while in the act of a B.J. I thought he really loved it, sounded that way."

She sticks her finger in my ass while giving me head, but it felt really good so I didn't stop her immediately. If I had not been enjoying it so much, I would have stopped her and asked what the hell she was doing sticking her finger in my ass.

5)"After it was over he said he didn't feel like it was manly, and it made him feel awkward. WHAT! I tell you all- He blazed to get out of my house. Its the next day, and usually he will call me in the morning before work, no call."

Afterward, I get to thinking that this "finger in the ass" thing is not a manly thing to be doing (manly things: Drinking beer, lifting weights, watching "Home Improvement" etc.)(unmanly things: Sticking something in your ass, wearing women's cothing, drinking Shirley Temples, watching "Will and Grace" etc.) and it's kind of scary that my girlfriend wants do do that. I'm getting out of here and I'm not sure whether I want to see her any more if she's going to do things like that. There's no telling what she has in mind for next time.

Now it seems to me that they do have a communication problem, but it's on his end. She told him a number of times she wanted to try new things. He was probably expecting something, but if he did not feel comfortable with what she did, he should have stopped her immediately and said so. Bad communication on his part. Afterward, instead of explaining why he didn't like what happened, he couldn't leave fast enough. Then he fails to call like normal the next day. Another communication failure.

Maybe instead of "homophobia" he has "analphobia". LOL Maybe the solution would be to show him the info on this site to let him know it is not something "wrong" or uncommon.

And as to this:
[QUOTE=Quote ]Are people who don't like chocolate ice cream racist???[/QUOTE]
They may not be racist, but there is definately something wrong with them.

Oh, good lord, not liking anal stimulation doesn't make someone a "homophobe".  If someone doesn't enjoy it, then they shouldn't do it.  You only become a homophobe when you start disapproving of others doing and enjoying it.

It sounds to me like Canoestripper hit the nail on the head... he experienced homophobia (as in the "fear that this might means he was or make him gay").  If he's a straight guy, then it's totally understandable.  He's probably heard all his life that this is what gay men do.  The key word there is "men".  It's your orientation in partners... not acts that determines your sexuality

Startingover specifically said, "I thought he really loved it, sounded that way. "  What you need to do it talk to him about it.  If he didn't enjoy it, that's one thing... don't do it anymore.  But if he enjoyed it but feels it "makes him gay", then he needs a little education. Many straight guys enjoy anal stimulation.  And as long as they are doing it with women... even if she uses a big old strap-on... he's still straight.  

Take care.

Call me a "homophobe" or "anti-gay" if you like, but I personally am not interested in anal - giving or receiving. There is no rule I know of that states a guy has to enjoy or approve of anal action to prove that he's not anti-gay!!

Are people who don't like chocolate ice cream racist???

The only thing this incident "proves" is the importance of communication, particularly when it comes to experimentation in the sexual arena.

You know, it's possible that he felt "unmanly" and "awkward" because he believes it's the man's role to be the aggressor. The rest of your post somewhat supports that notion.

"He prides himself on his action in the bedroom and I don't want to burst his bubble, so I gently talked to him about new things."

And when you did... he said? Did you tell him specifically some of the things you were planning to try?

I don't know what he's thinking and, for that matter, he may not himself. Why not call him and "gently" ask?

i agree he is also probably embarrased.

Welcome, startingover

[QUOTE=Quote ]After it was over he said he didn't feel like it was manly, and it made him feel awkward.[/QUOTE]
Sounds like homophobia to me.

[QUOTE=Quote ]I recently did prostate messaging while in the act of a B.J. I thought he really loved it, sounded that way.[/QUOTE]
The fact that it felt good and he liked it probably scared the Hell out of him. For some, anal=gay. He feels he shouldn't do anything anal (pun not intended), because he's not gay. Thus the unmanly and awkward statement.

Depending on how deep this fear goes, you may have really scared him off. Try talking it out with him. If he can't come to terms with it, you'll have to decide the best course for you.

Hope everything works out.