Way back to the Puritans? Read Leviticus and Deuteronomy. I am sure that oral tradition goes back even further. Like, maybe twenty-thousand years or so whenever men determined that their was a connection between sex and pregnancy and they wanted to know whose kids were whose.
Do you really believe God is that judgemental? I believe only the "die-hard" religious people believe it. Do you buy a car without test driving it?
What you both choose to do is between you two--no one else. If you are good people and live a good life, helpful of other's; I believe that is all that counts and it's no one else's business. If you are a good person in your heart, that is what matters & not what you do sexually more so with a person you plan to marry. Religion is an institution built on traditions which serves for guidance only, adopting a lifestyle is up to you! Think outside the box.
If you are going to hell for that...I'll see you there, as there will be EVERYONE else there too!
As a Catholic; I was always taught God was kind and forgiving and understood we are human. Here is a different spin on the whole sex without marriage part; I am divorced and have an annulment through the Catholic Church. Therefore, the Church views me as never having been married--fine and dandy. Now, if I was to re-marry as the Church sees me "free to"; since I lived with a man, had sex with him, was never advised to go to confession (not that I would for that), does that make me a sinner? When I asked the Marriage Tribunal & the Archdioses, the answer was no, despite the fact I had sex & was never married. Why did I bring that up? To show the ambiguity in the Church & hopefully to allow you to draw your own personal thoughts. Even when we married in the Church (we were already legally married) I was never asked if we had engaged in "premarital" sex (the Church's view since they do not recognize a marriage outside of the church, they see you as living in sin).
FYI...I read in Newsweek or some such article of women who were 60+ years old, 1000's of participants, those who said they were virgins (to their kids or community members) when they married--it was about 98% said they lied! LOL!
I would say that you can't. If you are religious to the point that intercourse is out of the question, then oral would be too. I was brought up as Independent Baptist, I was taught that anything more then a peck is a definite "no no". That being said, I was also taught that God will forgive any sin. I don't know what your religion is, but I would think that it's pretty much the same for you.
If you believe that sex is bad and only for procreation then you may have a religious, ethical, moral, dilemma to sort out.
If you adhere to the Puritan Ethic and Victorian view of sex you will again have some logic to consider based upon what science has contributed to our collective worldly knowledge.
Are you framing your question around premarital fooling around, or, what you might do after saying
"I Do"? **
If you subscribe to the notion from days gone by that masturbating is a sin and you will waste your limited supply of sperm, well, you have much to learn about physiology and biology.
Now, lets get down to it. What is oral sex? In and of itself, it is not "sex" as in intercourse is sex, it is yet another form of caressing with the intent being to please and arouse. Because it is more intimate, often ending with a climax, the activity falls into the category of Foreplay, rather than Necking or Petting (commonly known as "Making Out").
So you touch his or her genitals with your lips and tongue, what is so different than your fingers, a feather, fur cloth--or a vibrator for that matter?
Let's back up: So you touch his or her breasts, forehead, earlobes, neck, arms, hands, fingers buttocks, legs, feet, toes, or anywhere in between with your lips and tongue. Are these caresses sinful? Would they be if instead of brushing your lips or your tongue over your partner's skin, you opted to apply a bit of suction here or there? If your answer is no, then how does touching a penis, scrotum, or vulva differ from these other places?
The skin of your body is your largest sex organ. It is covered with sensitive nerve endings that when touched cause both pleasure and arousal. Is one area more off limits than another. If you answer, yes, then why? Because of some preconceived notion of impurity or dirtiness? Where's the logic and reason based upon modern day knowledge--especially if you recently bathed?
** If your question is in regard to your romantic activities before marriage, then you have to find your own common limits and boundaries based upon your moral beliefs and cultural norms.
If your question is in regard to what is OK to do within the confines of your marriage, I believe the same criteria hold. As long as the two of you are in agreement and do not hurt one another, then nearly every activity is acceptable. Consider that in some states there are still laws on the books for certain sexual activities that were once against the law and/or a crime against Nature, still are, yet have not been used in decades to prosecute anyone.
Let's say your religious beliefs are based upon the King James version of the Bible. Are you aware that there are other versions? Of the many religions using this bible, there will be that many interpretations for many of the passages. Similarly, other religions have separate translations of their bible or "book" for the Word of God. Searching for a church to attend in a town or city can be challenging and time consuming. Locating one that squares with your sense of the universe and the other tenets mentioned above can keep a person from being centered and at peace.
I cannot tell you whether one or both of you will go to Hell; however, in my eclectic version of religion, the answer is NO. It is unfortunate that many religions have not kept up with what modern man has learned over the ages about himself, his place in the cosmos, and, the biology, physiology, and psychology that governs our existence. The Bible does seem to remain relevant with each generation yet when it comes to love, romance, sex, and attraction, seems to be way outdated. Now, having said that, who dates or out dates these bible passages? The church and the powers that be within be it a single individual, committee, or, a minister at the neighborhood house of God. It becomes personal and thus dictatorial. This is as far as I'm going to take this discussion. The rest is up to the two of you.
I see nothing wrong w/ it... but then I also don't agree w/ "Christians" who do everything in the book including oral and anal sex... BUT do not have vaginal sex... but still consider themselves "pure".
This isn't directed at you... just some posts we have had previously w/ similar questions about anal sex.
I didn't wait till marriage... but I did wait till I found someone I really cared about.
In the above link, there are some different views on sex and relationships... it does say oral is ok after marriage, lol, but didn't see anything about before.
I don't know how much I would believe that site tho, b/c it says that women on birth control pills may have aborted a unborn baby b/c their BCP prevented the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus! :rolleyes: :confused:
> I don't know how much I would believe that site tho, b/c it says that women on birth control pills may have aborted a unborn baby b/c their BCP prevented the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus!
My point, exactly. We've gone full circle back to what I was saying.
Whoever wrote that tidbit of information apparently does not know how hormonal contraceptives operate. If correct then the author would appear to be swaying the reader based upon either misinformation or that they will take the argument at face value and not research the facts of the matter.
God will not send you to Hell for having sex before marriage or for engaging in foreplay before marriage. Its that simple. At least that is what I believe. Sex is a blessed thing and is for us to enjoy.
[QUOTE=sera300;188785]
FYI...I read in Newsweek or some such article of women who were 60+ years old, 1000's of participants, those who said they were virgins (to their kids or community members) when they married--it was about 98% said they lied! [/QUOTE]
This goes way way back, back to the days of the Puritans. In those days the colonists believed sex had no purpose except for procreation, yet it is interesting how written accounts in diaries and other documents survive to tell a different story.
Many girls were pregnant at the time of their wedding and this fact was accepted and used to make sure the daughter was in fact married off.
[QUOTE=jdead120;188781]Me and my fiancee, are debating on weather we will go to hell for oral sex if it's a sin or not. so can someone help us?[/QUOTE]
I was just going over this thread after discussing this topic with someone else. Here is another question for you to mull over.
[QUOTE]This goes way way back, back to the days of the Puritans. In those days the colonists believed sex had no purpose except for procreation, yet it is interesting how written accounts in diaries and other documents survive to tell a different story. [/QUOTE]
During the Victorian era, when sex et al were taboo subjects, would a boy go to Hell for meeting with a Lady of the Night that his father arranged in order to teach his son about "the facts of life"? What about the father? What about the Lady?
Let's talk about single adult men, now. They go to the Lady in order to get their rocks off, reduce stress, and perhaps even to have a few moments of feminine interaction that he might long for at home. Considering the times of the Wild West when women were in short supply particularly during the time of Western Expansion, how can you possibly believe that these visits would send someone to Hell?
Let's talk about women during the latter period of the Victorian era. A lot of family doctors during the mid-late 1880s were putting into practice a cure for many of the common emotional and resulting physical complaints women went to have addressed. What was this cure-all? "Manipulation".
The family doctor would perform what we nowadays term "fingering" his patient's clitoris in order to bring about an orgasm. Maybe this is where the phrase "a magic cure" came from. I dunno. Do you believe knowing the mindset and beliefs of the time that these patients and their doctors are now in Hell? How do you suppose doctors acquired this amazing and enlightening bit of knowledge?
(If you want to watch a cute movie about those times and observe many of the hangups men and women had to contend with, rent "The Road To Wellville". It is a fun and entertaining story.)
I find it puzzling that it took until the mid 1960s and the advent of the "Sexual Revolution" to bring both genders together in the same bed for the common good. What enough men and women had been taking care of independently was just enough to change the world and how we view sex. Couples were finally working together in partnership. Learned scholars and medical studies resulted in what are known as "sex manuals" that taught many more people about modern day sex practices, human relationships and romance that leads up to this. Now we have the digital information age--and, "Digital Manipulation"! What will be next? "Virtual Sex"? Surely a group of people will band together and tell us why this will send participants to [COLOR="Red">Hell[/COLOR]. My question to them is how do you know?
Way back to the Puritans? Read Leviticus and Deuteronomy. I am sure that oral tradition goes back even further. Like, maybe twenty-thousand years or so whenever men determined that their was a connection between sex and pregnancy and they wanted to know whose kids were whose.
Well, if that's enough to get into hell, screw it - we're all doomed to eternal damnation. May as well enjoy the ride.
I think you two may have been grossly misled during your lives.... Sex is not evil.
Do you really believe God is that judgemental? I believe only the "die-hard" religious people believe it. Do you buy a car without test driving it?
What you both choose to do is between you two--no one else. If you are good people and live a good life, helpful of other's; I believe that is all that counts and it's no one else's business. If you are a good person in your heart, that is what matters & not what you do sexually more so with a person you plan to marry. Religion is an institution built on traditions which serves for guidance only, adopting a lifestyle is up to you! Think outside the box.
If you are going to hell for that...I'll see you there, as there will be EVERYONE else there too!
As a Catholic; I was always taught God was kind and forgiving and understood we are human. Here is a different spin on the whole sex without marriage part; I am divorced and have an annulment through the Catholic Church. Therefore, the Church views me as never having been married--fine and dandy. Now, if I was to re-marry as the Church sees me "free to"; since I lived with a man, had sex with him, was never advised to go to confession (not that I would for that), does that make me a sinner? When I asked the Marriage Tribunal & the Archdioses, the answer was no, despite the fact I had sex & was never married. Why did I bring that up? To show the ambiguity in the Church & hopefully to allow you to draw your own personal thoughts. Even when we married in the Church (we were already legally married) I was never asked if we had engaged in "premarital" sex (the Church's view since they do not recognize a marriage outside of the church, they see you as living in sin).
FYI...I read in Newsweek or some such article of women who were 60+ years old, 1000's of participants, those who said they were virgins (to their kids or community members) when they married--it was about 98% said they lied! LOL!
I would say that you can't. If you are religious to the point that intercourse is out of the question, then oral would be too. I was brought up as Independent Baptist, I was taught that anything more then a peck is a definite "no no". That being said, I was also taught that God will forgive any sin. I don't know what your religion is, but I would think that it's pretty much the same for you.
What are your religious views and teachings?
If you believe that sex is bad and only for procreation then you may have a religious, ethical, moral, dilemma to sort out.
If you adhere to the Puritan Ethic and Victorian view of sex you will again have some logic to consider based upon what science has contributed to our collective worldly knowledge.
Are you framing your question around premarital fooling around, or, what you might do after saying
"I Do"? **
If you subscribe to the notion from days gone by that masturbating is a sin and you will waste your limited supply of sperm, well, you have much to learn about physiology and biology.
Now, lets get down to it. What is oral sex? In and of itself, it is not "sex" as in intercourse is sex, it is yet another form of caressing with the intent being to please and arouse. Because it is more intimate, often ending with a climax, the activity falls into the category of Foreplay, rather than Necking or Petting (commonly known as "Making Out").
So you touch his or her genitals with your lips and tongue, what is so different than your fingers, a feather, fur cloth--or a vibrator for that matter?
Let's back up: So you touch his or her breasts, forehead, earlobes, neck, arms, hands, fingers buttocks, legs, feet, toes, or anywhere in between with your lips and tongue. Are these caresses sinful? Would they be if instead of brushing your lips or your tongue over your partner's skin, you opted to apply a bit of suction here or there? If your answer is no, then how does touching a penis, scrotum, or vulva differ from these other places?
The skin of your body is your largest sex organ. It is covered with sensitive nerve endings that when touched cause both pleasure and arousal. Is one area more off limits than another. If you answer, yes, then why? Because of some preconceived notion of impurity or dirtiness? Where's the logic and reason based upon modern day knowledge--especially if you recently bathed?
** If your question is in regard to your romantic activities before marriage, then you have to find your own common limits and boundaries based upon your moral beliefs and cultural norms.
If your question is in regard to what is OK to do within the confines of your marriage, I believe the same criteria hold. As long as the two of you are in agreement and do not hurt one another, then nearly every activity is acceptable. Consider that in some states there are still laws on the books for certain sexual activities that were once against the law and/or a crime against Nature, still are, yet have not been used in decades to prosecute anyone.
Let's say your religious beliefs are based upon the King James version of the Bible. Are you aware that there are other versions? Of the many religions using this bible, there will be that many interpretations for many of the passages. Similarly, other religions have separate translations of their bible or "book" for the Word of God. Searching for a church to attend in a town or city can be challenging and time consuming. Locating one that squares with your sense of the universe and the other tenets mentioned above can keep a person from being centered and at peace.
I cannot tell you whether one or both of you will go to Hell; however, in my eclectic version of religion, the answer is NO. It is unfortunate that many religions have not kept up with what modern man has learned over the ages about himself, his place in the cosmos, and, the biology, physiology, and psychology that governs our existence. The Bible does seem to remain relevant with each generation yet when it comes to love, romance, sex, and attraction, seems to be way outdated. Now, having said that, who dates or out dates these bible passages? The church and the powers that be within be it a single individual, committee, or, a minister at the neighborhood house of God. It becomes personal and thus dictatorial. This is as far as I'm going to take this discussion. The rest is up to the two of you.
Try Here
I see nothing wrong w/ it... but then I also don't agree w/ "Christians" who do everything in the book including oral and anal sex... BUT do not have vaginal sex... but still consider themselves "pure".
This isn't directed at you... just some posts we have had previously w/ similar questions about anal sex.
I didn't wait till marriage... but I did wait till I found someone I really cared about.
In the above link, there are some different views on sex and relationships... it does say oral is ok after marriage, lol, but didn't see anything about before.
I don't know how much I would believe that site tho, b/c it says that women on birth control pills may have aborted a unborn baby b/c their BCP prevented the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus! :rolleyes: :confused:
> I don't know how much I would believe that site tho, b/c it says that women on birth control pills may have aborted a unborn baby b/c their BCP prevented the fertilized egg from implanting in the uterus!
My point, exactly. We've gone full circle back to what I was saying.
Whoever wrote that tidbit of information apparently does not know how hormonal contraceptives operate. If correct then the author would appear to be swaying the reader based upon either misinformation or that they will take the argument at face value and not research the facts of the matter.
God will not send you to Hell for having sex before marriage or for engaging in foreplay before marriage. Its that simple. At least that is what I believe. Sex is a blessed thing and is for us to enjoy.
[QUOTE=sera300;188785]
FYI...I read in Newsweek or some such article of women who were 60+ years old, 1000's of participants, those who said they were virgins (to their kids or community members) when they married--it was about 98% said they lied! [/QUOTE]
This goes way way back, back to the days of the Puritans. In those days the colonists believed sex had no purpose except for procreation, yet it is interesting how written accounts in diaries and other documents survive to tell a different story.
Many girls were pregnant at the time of their wedding and this fact was accepted and used to make sure the daughter was in fact married off.
[QUOTE=jdead120;188781]Me and my fiancee, are debating on weather we will go to hell for oral sex if it's a sin or not. so can someone help us?[/QUOTE]
I was just going over this thread after discussing this topic with someone else. Here is another question for you to mull over.
[QUOTE]This goes way way back, back to the days of the Puritans. In those days the colonists believed sex had no purpose except for procreation, yet it is interesting how written accounts in diaries and other documents survive to tell a different story. [/QUOTE]
During the Victorian era, when sex et al were taboo subjects, would a boy go to Hell for meeting with a Lady of the Night that his father arranged in order to teach his son about "the facts of life"? What about the father? What about the Lady?
Let's talk about single adult men, now. They go to the Lady in order to get their rocks off, reduce stress, and perhaps even to have a few moments of feminine interaction that he might long for at home. Considering the times of the Wild West when women were in short supply particularly during the time of Western Expansion, how can you possibly believe that these visits would send someone to Hell?
Let's talk about women during the latter period of the Victorian era. A lot of family doctors during the mid-late 1880s were putting into practice a cure for many of the common emotional and resulting physical complaints women went to have addressed. What was this cure-all? "Manipulation".
The family doctor would perform what we nowadays term "fingering" his patient's clitoris in order to bring about an orgasm. Maybe this is where the phrase "a magic cure" came from. I dunno. Do you believe knowing the mindset and beliefs of the time that these patients and their doctors are now in Hell? How do you suppose doctors acquired this amazing and enlightening bit of knowledge?
(If you want to watch a cute movie about those times and observe many of the hangups men and women had to contend with, rent "The Road To Wellville". It is a fun and entertaining story.)
I find it puzzling that it took until the mid 1960s and the advent of the "Sexual Revolution" to bring both genders together in the same bed for the common good. What enough men and women had been taking care of independently was just enough to change the world and how we view sex. Couples were finally working together in partnership. Learned scholars and medical studies resulted in what are known as "sex manuals" that taught many more people about modern day sex practices, human relationships and romance that leads up to this. Now we have the digital information age--and, "Digital Manipulation"! What will be next? "Virtual Sex"? Surely a group of people will band together and tell us why this will send participants to [COLOR="Red">Hell[/COLOR]. My question to them is how do you know?