I need some advice from a guy (or gal)

[bruins76]

Me and my man constantly have this argument about porn cause I feel like if he's looking at porn or pics on-line it's cause I don't do it for him anymore. I've gained weight since we got together (had his baby 4 mos ago) and it's hard for me to know that he's looking at these skinny, perfect body girls, I find it offensive to me. The thing that I don't understand is that I have porn of my own, toys...the whole nine and love sex, I have a higher drive than he does and if it were up to me we'd watch porn together etc., but he has no interest in it. I only view porn when he's not around, at work and I am horny...not much since I have 2 kids to watch and 1 of them is a baby.

The point that I've tried to make to my man is that I don't understand why he chooses to look at others all the time to get off when he has me in the other room, who love's him, wants' him and would do anything for him...anything but bring another female into our sexual world. I do everything, again...even in pain just to "get him off" and satisfy him and I feel like that's not good enough.

It make's me feel like he look's at this crap and then get's horny and then come's to bed w/ me and when we have sex he think's of these girls in order to get off, that he's having these visuals of screwing another girl other than me, it make's me feel inadequate as a person, woman and human, I feel disgusting.

Another thing that's bothered me is that he tries to hide it from me, erase his "history" on the computer (but I am computer savy and know how to see what he's looked at)...so I always end up checking up on him and then I get even more hurt.

The other day we had this exact argument and he said "I feel like you are checking up on me, you are treating me like a child, I am afraid that if I am watching a movie w/ a sex scene that I am going to get in trouble"...so I finally broke down and said that I feel inadequate as a human, as his partner that he's looking at stuff when I am in the other room. I could totally understand if I was withholding sex from him, if I never gave into his "needs" etc., then I'd get this whole looking at porn/pics thing, but since I do all of the above (except a threesome which I will NEVER do) I don't understand why that's not good enough.

When I was pregnant he barely touched me...he said he was turned off cause of the pain the I was in...he was full of it cause aside from my swollen feet (which has nothing to do w/ having sex) I was not in any pain, I practically had to force him to have sex w/ me and it was only 1 time per month that he'd give into me and I was lonely, horny and crying all the time cause I knew that he wasn't attracted to me anymore. I was hurt, I thought that if you loved someone, regardless of the changes (w/in reason and I was pregnant & weight gain was to be expected) should not be a reason to deny the person you love any sex. Well...he did. He never told me that I was glowing, he never told me that I looked good, he never said anything to compliment me. Still doesn't... I brought that up and he said "I am not that type of person"...he said "I tell you I love you all the time and I buy you expensive thing's all the time"...yes he's right, but it's the LITTLE thing's that count, not the materials cause if there were a fire tomorrow and all the "things" were parished, what would be left of our love to show me???

He still doesn't get it. I told him that it insults me that he listens to Howard Stern everyday...now granted not all is smutt but every day they put some chick (regardless if she's hot or not) and they have the girl ride this SYBIAN and listen to her get off and what not, well...that bother's me, that's he's listening to other's get off. Again, he doesn't get it.

Another part of this is that EVERYTIME (except once literally) every time we have sex he talks very dirty to me, always talks about another girl doing "this and that" to me while he ****'s me. Sorry, that grosses me out, turn's me off and I am sick and tired of hearing how he wants to F**K me instead of make love to me (which again only said 1 time in our entire 2 year relationship). Now I am all for talking dirty, but does it always have to revolve around another girl in the bedroom and being nasty? Yes sometimes I do like it (I told him that I do like it on OCCASION) but once in a while it would be nice to know that the intimacy is between the 2 of us, no fantasy, no porn, no raunchy talk, just the two of us, is that so bad to ask?

I told him all of this...again he still doesn't get it. I even pointed out to him that there are MANY men out there that would LOVE to have a significant other in their lives that would be willing to do the things that I do for him in the bedroom, I am willing to watch porn w/ him, I am willing to use toys and I am willing to do what ever whenever...that he should appreciate me. That "if" I were one of those girlie girls that were strictly the type to only have missionary sex, never performe oral sex on him and never even talk a dirty word let alone use a toy or watch porn w/ him, I'd completely understand why he'd want to view porn on-line, I really would understand it, but the fact that I am just as kinky (if not more so) I don't get why I am still not good enough for him.

I've cried, and cried about this, to myself, friends, my therapist and my man how this make's me feel...nothing and no one has answer's for me. I even said to my man "just tell me if I don't do it for you, tell me I don't turn you on anymore, just be honest cause it's how you feel and I know it"...he insisted I was out of my mind, that he love's me and that I am making a bigger deal out of this than necessary.

Well, after reading your post, I now know that I am not the only one and that there has got to be a way to understand this, come to some sort of aggreement. I don't expect him to never satisfy himself or ever have a fantasy again, but why do I feel like he's doing it daily?

Bottom line, it hurts...bad...and it's to the point that I am considering leaving him over it. I too have "talked" to men...that's it, never in person either...just as friends but cause I feel so badly about myself I want to get the attention elsewhere. I'd never cheat on him, I wouldn't even think of it, but I feel like if he's not going to give me the emotional need's that I desire then perhaps I should terminate the relationship and find someone who will.

The problem is that aside from this, he's a wonderful man, father, hard working, adorable, caring, sweet, kind...I can't say enough about him. The only issues I have w/ him aside from this is his ex-wife and his temper which I have an ex cause I too have a child from a previous relationship so I am the last person to judge and I too have a temper which I take medication for. No one is perfect. I'd hate to see our 2+ year relationship be over based on something like this, I never thought I'd have to feel this way.

I need a man's (or gal's) opinion here... what's going on really and how should I handle this???

~C

[NizeGie]

I need a man's (or gal's) opinion here... what's going on really and how should I handle this???

Hmm. I started off thinking the question was about the "porn thing," but your post rapidly ran off into lots of different areas. I got the distinct (though perhaps mistaken) impression that the porn issue is the tip of the iceberg. Plus, it seems like it might be a pretty big iceberg ... perhaps one that calls for someone with a lot of expertise in iceberg exploration. Like the kind who has an MD or a PhD in psychology.

[bruins76]

You are accurate in that this is not the "only" issue here, there are others. And yes I've suggested on more than several occasions that counseling would benefit us since we don't know how to resolve these issues considering that after 2 years they have yet to be resolved since day one.

Long story short I said "this issue(s) can be fixed & w/ a professional's help they may be able to help both of us get through this".... he said "I don't believe in therapy"... then I said "so you'd rather watch our relationship die instead of getting help that would get us through this?" he said "yes"...

Now to give you the reason for this, his ex wife put him through the ringer. She not only verbally and physically abused him, but he did everything to satisfy her, including go to counseling and every time he went to counseling he felt attacked and the end result was still divorced. Then there is his mother...she forced him to go to counseling as a child and again he said he felt attacked and the end result was a poor relationship w/ his mother.

I've pointed out to this man that he is judging a professional (PHD etc) in the wrong context. That not all therapist's are judgemental (I've had my fair share of bad experiences w/ those types too)...but I see one now for my own issues who I feel doesn't do that, she is always pointing out things that I do wrong and what I need to do to fix it and she stick's up for my guy on lot's of occasions so she isn't the type to attack like that.

Basically, he wont go to counseling cause of his past experience w/ it, doesn't believe in it & it's a result of other women in his life who ruined him. I am paying for THEIR mistakes... I've told him this MANY, MANY times...I am not those persons and I shouldn't have to pay for them, etc.

But aside from the "other" issues that I do have in this relationship (as any relationship has many issues, not just one). I am confused on how to address this porn/sex thing, what I can do to understand this or make him understand the hurt that I have.

I don't think it's fair that he give up his "fantasies" and I don't think it's fair that he dabble in his fantasies at the expense of my feeling's either. So how does one deal w/ it so both are happy?

Thanks for reading,
~C

[WallyLlama]

See my post in the other thread about porn for a different approach to this...

When you've read that... come back and add this to that thought:

Telling somebody they have a problem and getting them to fix it rarely works. (Not every PHd Therapist understands that, BTW. Let's not make therapists gods.) You also can't "pull out" one issue like porn - because while relationships have many issues, those issues are inter-related. I have to point out your choice of words: you can't "make him" understand this or your hurt. That is absolutely a true statement. I'll suggest you consider the cost of your continued effort given that you aren't going to succeed.

See, the "other approach" involves demonstrating how to achieve change and growth. You show the other person how you solve a problem. Assuming your diagnosis of him is correct and he hates therapists it doesn't make much sense for you to try to be his by explaining what's wrong with him and the relationship. Follow the pattern and see that you are dangerously close to becoming the thing he despises!

Step over to his side of the relationship and you'll see that you are close to treating him the same way his ex did -- albeit a bit gentler. Every time he went to therapy he felt attacked... stop attacking him! He's even told you he feels that you are treating him like a child. Listen to him!

Show him how it's done... make the porn (or whatever) YOUR issue because in the final analysis it is. Ask yourself the same question you asked him: are you going to let this relationship die because you don't want him looking at porn?

If this all sounds nuts to you, that's good because nuts is the way to go, in a sense. What you've been doing isn't working and doing more of it and doing it harder isn't going to make it work. It doesn't matter whether what he says or does is right - because it's YOUR right. Stop deciding and telling him what he's doing wrong!!!

Sometimes if you want a different response you have to try a different stimulus.

[bruins76]

Show him how it's done... make the porn (or whatever) YOUR issue because in the final analysis it is.

Sometimes if you want a different response you have to try a different stimulus.

What do you mean show him how it's done? I don't understand how to do that.What type of stimulus do you mean?



Now I know that the porn thing is an insecurity that "I" have and I know it's how I am feeling etc., etc.... I guess my constant complaint to my guy has been "if something is hurting me, why would you want to continue doing it regardless if you understand it or not?" Like if my man didn't want me to do something cause it made him insecure (which he's already done/demanded and I've stopped as a result of his insecurities)...then why doesn't it go both ways?

His issue was my friends. All my gal pals (whom are married) cheat on their husbands, every single one. I made the mistake of telling my guy this information when we started dating, as thing's between us got serious he finally freaked out one day and said he couldn't handle me being around them all the time. Now I still see my pals and he's okay w/ that, but I am not allowed to go out w/ them and if and when I do (which is almost never, since the baby none)...he make's jealous comments and check's up on me.

He said "how would you feel if you knew that all my friends' cheated on their wives/girlfriends and I hung out w/ them?" so again...I have made adjustments based on HIS feelings. They are all still my friends but I've made a point to be more sensitive to him. My pals' have asked me to go to Vegas w/ them, he says, and I quote "no way, your not going!" ...he freak's out...all my gal pals are either Hooter's girls, former models, vegas show girls, actresses that play the dumb blondes or brunettes on movies (like water boy w/ Adam Sandler)...he freak's out cause all my friends are in the spotlight and he knows that men flock to them and he's afraid that I'll stray.

We've been together for 2 years, I have a child w/ this man, I have NO desire to be w/ anyone other than him. I tell him all the time. I've never cheated on him or given him any reason to think otherwise, yet he treat's me like I am doing something behind his back. He call's me all day long, check's up on me etc., then if I ask him "who are you talking too?" (which he does to me ALL the time) he freak's out on me as if I am badgering him!

Bottom line, he doesn't trust me, he think's I am going to leave him cause A) I have lot's of friends who do the WRONG thing and B) all his ex situations left him burnt and hurt emotional & financially.
I trust him that he wont cheat on me, but I have a fear of abandonment cause everyone in my life has left me, out of the blue (parents, siblings, friends) and I fear that he'll leave w/ out explanation as well. I also feel inadequate physically cause of my body changes since the birth of my children, I always had the "perfect" body and even after plastic surgery I am still unhappy w/ my body cause I am unhappy internally I know that, again it's my issue (which I seek weekly counseling for).

The problem is I've always had men in my life who have fed my ego, told me how gorgeous I was, drooled over me etc., my man has NEVER acted this way, probably a reason why I was so interested in him at the begining, he was a challenge but he also showed respect for me and didn't treat me like a piece of meat, a good thing. But again...I am so used to compliments or reassurments that not hearing anything from my guy make's me "WONDER" if I am good enough. KWIM?

I asked him the other day "what is it about me that made you fall in love w/ me? what is it about me that you love?" know what he said? "how you are w/ the kids, how you take care of the house"... so I said "what is it between the two of us that you love...about me personally, not what I do around the house or what type of mother that I am cause when we are old and gray I wont be raising babies all my life"... know what he said to me??? That I am FUNNY! FUNNY?!?!?! Are you kidding me? Okay, I am sarcastic and have been told that I am funny, but how is that something that make's him all warm and fuzzy for me? humor? how about how I look? the way I smile? how I touch him or how I am sympathetic or patient w/ his kid and his situation? nope, just funny. I don't know why but that just doesn't make sense to me.

Funny? should I take this as a compliment from someone who love's me? The most he's ever said to me is "I don't want to lose you" and "you mean the world to me, I'd be lost w/ out you"... these were the words he uttered when I told him I was leaving him once. He does tell me often that he love's me, and that he wants to spend the rest of his life w/ me and how he want's no one else other than me, which I do appreciate and I love to hear. I guess I just feel inadequate physically cause he never compliments my physical qualities, yes they are superficial but sometime's it's nice to hear, no? yes? it wouldn't hurt, that's for sure.

Okay, okay...I am rambling now.

Thanks again for reading & giving advice
~C

[yuna5]

i think maybe you should compliment him on the good stuff he does. Everytime he does something that pleases you say, "I really like that you did that." In sex, when he does things to please you in the way that you like, moan, say oh, ahh, mmmm, i like that- to keep him doing it.

also, if he says he doesn't want to have sex that might mean he's not sufficiently turned on by you, not that he doesn't want you to touch him. So focus on gettiing him relaxed and turned on as much as possible- focus on his needs first. Give him a nice long massage. Touch him gently in ways and places that please you as well as him. You can be turning yourself on at the same time you're turning him on. Like something you do may on the surface seem to only please him but psychologically adn physically doing it to him turns you on, even if it's lightly stroking his body, or kissing him softly. The theory is you could even have an orgasm while being 100% the giver and never taking. of course this should happen only occasionally, it should be a give and take. and by touching him in ways that pleasee you you could also be teaching him how to touch you.

I also read some good advice that said even if he's touching you wrong, to compliment and encourage him to give him self confidence and then he'll be open to your requests and he won't feel like he's inadequate or your attacking him.

About the porno, i'm usually one who says, well, if he's doing it, do it to him and see how it makes him feel. talk dirty during sex about another guy and imagine another guy during sex with him- make it very obvious- and if he complains say isn't this the same thing you do to me? watch porn to your content, while he's in the same room- just be a bigger and better version of the jerk he's being so he can see how it makes you feel. that's my immediate advice.

But sometimes that won't work. Then, i'd just compliment him on the gifts he gives you, everytime he says "i love you" make sure he knows you appreciate it, and give him suggestions of what you'd like right after you compliment him, like, you know what could be even better, if you made a poem or recited a poem or song to me about your love, or you did something really special and romantic for me on Valentines. Just compliment, stop complaining, stop crying in front of him, he just doesn't understand- you have to explain it in a way that he can understand. so i hope these suggestions help you. You're a great person and you deserve to be happy. Think outside the box- things that you don't think could work could do the trick. There's probably more ideas that seem wierd that would work in your situation. i'll write more if i come up with any.

[pawnys]

I didn't really read any of this.. to long and I gotta go.. but if he's viewing porn and coming to bed.. chances are.. he was thinking of a threesome.. or like I've done.. (and still seems weird to me) is thinking of having sex with the porn girl.. my girl coming in, killing the porn girl... (no blood.. just like.. porn girl fades) and then we make mad love.. Some guys.. they need another stimulus to have sex with their partner. I don't really know.. I jsut know that sometimes I get uber horny, thinking of my girl, it dosen't work think of threesome bam.. fresh load. Sometimes he might just be comparing them -to- you.. instead of vise verca.. ever think of that?

[yuna5]

i think if you're in a relationship, Pawnys, that you should only imagine sex with your partner. You can look at a body and take pleasure from it, that you can't help because you see people all the time, but you don't have to imagine sex with that person. If you only imagine sex with your partner you're more likely to be faithful. And it's just respectful and romantic. I understand that it may just be a way to turn you on but it's like, you wouldn't kill a person in order to turn yourself on, so maybe you don't have to imagine other people to turn yourself on- be creative about what you imagine with your woman, think outside the box- it'll probably please her and show you there are many ways to turn yourself on and stay faithful in your imagination.

[NizeGie]

Originally Posted by yuna5

i think if you're in a relationship, Pawnys, that you should only imagine sex with your partner.

Perhaps we're giving a different meaning to the word "imagine."

But my reaction (speaking as a guy, which is all I can speak as): that's entirely unrealistic. It's probably impossible. That is, unless you define "imagine" to mean something like: "picture the thing and plan how it could happen in obsessive detail."

For one thing, you have limited conscious control over your imagination. Try this: don't think about a white bear. Now, cut that out! Stop thinking about that white bear!

Even Jimmy Carter looked at women with lust in his heart.

[yuna5]

NizeGie, here is my full quote "You can look at a body and take pleasure from it, that you can't help because you see people all the time, but you don't have to imagine sex with that person. "

i think that's very doable. you can feel lust for a person just looking at their body, you don't have to imagine sex with them too, i think.